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SCCA, Review the Use of Marked Tires

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#41
john mueller

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Been lurking...  This sounds like a great idea but it's too labor intensive for most regions to manage properly and just adds a layer of scrutiny that may not need to be there (competition is pretty good y'all).  Besides, the arms race can't be stopped.  Those with the cash will out spend the rest to gain whatever advantage they think can be found.  So IMO if unlimited supply of tires is taken away they'll find something else to monkey with.

 

From my biased seat I'd love to see SCCA move back to Toyo and the new RR (doesn't need to be shaved and lasts forever).  In my mind that would solve a lot of issues.


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#42
Caveman-kwebb99

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Mueller I would support you on that if we could use Hoosier rains... the ra1 sucks as a rain tire is useless...

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#43
Johnny D

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Hey now, the tire rental biz could be huge for people crossing over. :rotfl:

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#44
Rob Burgoon

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Hey now, the tire rental biz could be huge for people crossing over. :rotfl:

J~

 

 

 

That's actually a potential problem with my scheme.  What's to stop motivated folks from entering two cars and doing a start and park to get fresh tires on Sunday from the second car?


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#45
Johnny D

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Rentals are supposed to be hand me downs from the top driver that would never run over however many cycles 6~8 I hear.

Totally loosing a 10th or so. O.M.G.

 

I haven't run them, so I don't know what's the difference between heat cycle 1 and 8 if any.

But the whole 2nd car, flat spot, whatever, sound (spells) like your earlier post.

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#46
Johnny D

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Does sound like a lot of work. Will see how many people send letters for or against.

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#47
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I should send a letter, I think its a BS rule. We can't even keep up with tech regarding if people are using a restrictor plate now we are going to throw in another administrative rule to check on.

 

I just like having the freedom to decide what, where, when and why and the less input from others the better for me.


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#48
Keith Novak

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It wouldn't be that hard to enforce.  Each driver gets a tire pen on grid and gets to mark the drivers tires of their choice.  At impound, the drivers can police each other by checking to make sure whatever obscene prase they wrote on the tires is still there. 


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#49
Danny Steyn

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My bad, I though you were only doing COTA, Sprints, Runoffs and didn't care much about the rest.

 

Rob - its because Jim only cares about the Sprints and the Runoffs that he is doing 12 weekends this year ..... no way to stay sharp with 3 weekends!


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#50
john mueller

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Mueller I would support you on that if we could use Hoosier rains... the ra1 sucks as a rain tire is useless...

 

They (RA1's) work pretty well for me in the rain...  Race the track bro.


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#51
Danny Steyn

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Does sound like a lot of work. Will see how many people send letters for or against.

J~

Johnny D - I think most will NOT write, most will accept what the class decides. Personally I dont like the fact that I spend more running the Hoosier than the Toyo. But I have done well with the Hoosier contingency, so that offsets the expense somewhat. Do not want to go back to shaving. And I would like to see a Spec Tire.

WRT rain tires - I would MUCH prefer we go back to the Toyo rains - the lasted years. Yup they sucked in the rain, but they sucked for everyone. The H2O's wear out so quickly, you might need new rains after a single session that dries out midway.


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#52
Johnny D

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I just saw it and posted it. Run it up the flagpole.

 

Interesting how it's gone. I agree with you and others.

One Spec tire for all clubs would be nice.

Harder, cheaper, etc.

J~


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#53
Mike Collins

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Damn you guys run sticker tires? I just get Ted's take-offs...

Ted takes tires off every session ;)


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#54
john mueller

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Do not want to go back to shaving. And I would like to see a Spec Tire.

 

I would MUCH prefer we go back to the Toyo rains - the lasted years. Yup they sucked in the rain, but they sucked for everyone. The H2O's wear out so quickly, you might need new rains after a single session that dries out midway.

 

Toyo RR's don't need shaving

 

+1 on they "sucked for everyone" but saved a ton of money over the life...  Being from SoCal I'm still running full depth RA-1's from 2009.


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#55
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I for one hope to leave things as they are. I like the overall feel and longevity of the new Hoosiers. Even though I don't have the largest tire budget I support ones right to use as many tires as they see fit. I'd much rather have some of these drivers on tires with some grip as opposed to out of control cars. The body damage in this class is already too high.
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#56
Jim Boemler

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It wouldn't be that hard to enforce.  Each driver gets a tire pen on grid and gets to mark the drivers tires of their choice.  At impound, the drivers can police each other by checking to make sure whatever obscene prase they wrote on the tires is still there. 

An elegant solution, but given that some drivers team up (and some others team up to win at all costs), I suspect there's a fly in that ointment.  Also, in those circumstances where the rule is broken, but compassion is reasonable, one driver is singled out to be the rat.  I suspect it would fall apart rapidly.



#57
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Damn you guys run sticker tires? I just get Ted's take-offs...

So I can keep the 5 tires that got delivered yesterday :)


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#58
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Haha - no you'll be putting those on Ted's car! I'd like to thank Hoosier for the contingency program however.

 

I find it odd that we're focused on the issue of qual/race tires, as opposed to the real issue, which is that the tires aren't good past 4 or so heat cycles. Why not fix the problem instead of putting a bandage on it?

 

And whoever commented about 1/32 shaves, find another excuse. I personally never shaved less than 2/32, and usually went a light 3/32 so I could use those tires for practice days, AND THEY WERE STILL GOOD FOR 2 DAYS OF QUAL/RACING, PLUS practice the next race and then great for those tracks that needed tires 3 laps from cording.

 

The tire we have now is very expensive to run due to the limited heat cycles, and it has so much grip we are finding new ways to break/wear out parts. To top it all off, the added grip puts more emphasis on HP since it's easier for everyone to drive faster through the corners.

 

So what do you really want to solve?


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#59
Mike Collins

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I've said it before, so I will say it again as we start beating on this horse.  The hoosier is fine...  We just need the 195/50-15 version.  The current tire is too much tire for our car.  It's considerably bigger than the Toyo, it matches the 225 Toyo in size.  With the 195 (a tire Hoosier doesn't make) we would have less grip in the corner due to the weight of the car.  Car control would come back to the class and tires would last longer.  I also think we could also use a harder compound.  The track side support Hoosier offers is excellent, so much better than ordering tires in the mail and then having to go mount and balance hand shaved eggs.

 

My $0.02 FWIW.

 

 

PS - Marking the tires will NEVER work!!!!!!!!!!


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#60
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And whoever commented about 1/32 shaves, find another excuse. I personally never shaved less than 2/32, and usually went a light 3/32 so I could use those tires for practice days, AND THEY WERE STILL GOOD FOR 2 DAYS OF QUAL/RACING, PLUS practice the next race and then great for those tracks that needed tires 3 laps from cording.

You forgot to add, and I don't know anybody that shaved tires to 1/32 inch. "Excuse", don't make the comment something that it was not.
:nonono:

The point of the original comment was/is, those that race at the front will do whatever to stay at the front. Tire or whatever other part, brand doesn't matter.
 


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