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1.6 lost all oil pressure while on trailer

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#1
Brian129

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So I took my build, which is mostly completed out to roebling road for a trackday this past weekend.

For the most part the car ran great!!! Track was fun. In the morning I was on a set of DZ101 street tires. Later on I switched to some supposedly
Shagged Ra1's. Man even 12 years old and having barely over two grooves left, actually did pretty well!! Now I need to find something to use more regularly.

All in one piece after a fun day of track beating.
563447C2-D9B0-4A3A-9A24-E5C16F529BB8.jpg

Anyway, at the end of the day the car is still running fine, no issues, so I drive it up on the trailer and pack up.
Drive back to Atlanta and go to unload the car off the trailer. ( I locked the doors after parking it on the trailer, and only unlocked them now while unloading) open the door reach in and start it up, I walk around to the back of the car and undo the straps, realizing it still sounds like lifter clatter, so I look back in at the dash.
I have 0 oil pressure on the gauge, and a check engine light on. I turn it off, check the oil level, and see it's fine. Go back start it up, same as it was, and turn it off.

What the hell??
I did nothing to it, it drove back to the pits, and around the paddock a bit after the track day, no issues.
I know I had good oil pressure on the cool down lap of the last session.

The motor is a 122,000 mile street engine, that I checked over, all bearings looked good, and the pump had good clearances and minimal wear. It's run 1 Autocross test day, 1 trackday, and maybe 800 street miles since taking it mostly apart to reseat everything.

I'm stumped how it could break itself riding on the trailer,
Any tips or suggestions? I really do t want to yank the motor again

#2
Mark

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Easy things first. Check the oil pressure sender wire. The sensor is under the intake manifold next to the oil filter. Kind of a bugger to get to. If the sensor connection looks ok I'd probably swap in a replacement sensor as a next step.


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#3
Brian129

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Well there was clatter was there too, though it didn't sound like no oil pounding. I'm thinking it really is zero oil pressure, I plan to put a gauge on and see.
I did check the sender wire, it was still fine and in place.

#4
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Drain the oil, if it truly has zero pressure and it making noise then the oil and filter will have bearing material in them.  I'm betting its the sending unit like Mark said.  


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chris haldeman

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Oil pump plunger stuck. Time for a rebuild or replace.
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#6
Jim Drago

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Oil pump plunger stuck. Time for a rebuild or replace.


I think Chris may be correct. Start again and pull the filll cap in valve cover, see if you have any oil there.. If not.. it will need to come apart. A small piece of debris will stick those things

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#7
Alberto

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Oil pump plunger stuck. Time for a rebuild or replace.

 

 

 

I think Chris may be correct. Start again and pull the filll cap in valve cover, see if you have any oil there.. If not.. it will need to come apart. A small piece of debris will stick those things

 

 

 

Can you guys elaborate what this means?  Is there a way to check this?


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#8
Brian129

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I think Chris may be correct. Start again and pull the filll cap in valve cover, see if you have any oil there.. If not.. it will need to come apart. A small piece of debris will stick those things

 

unfortunately,  the more i look into this no oil pressure thing,  the more I think you are correct. 

 

if it really has none it can only be broken pump gears, or stuck relief valve. 

and a little clatter would be indicative of the relief as I don't hear an obnoxious sound of a broken pump gear spinning in the housing.  

 

is there any chance of clearing this, or is it just pull the motor? I know I cant really get the pan off in the car.  this bites,  I just put the thing together 2 months ago. 

 

I was planning to build it a race motor for later,  I have a spare engine and RE built head that I was going to put together for that,  but it seem a waste for trackdays right now. 



#9
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Options:

Do you have a Miata factory shop manual? If yes, under pages D-7, 8, 9 oil pan removal/inspection/installation it provides steps to lower front subframe/crossmember for approx 4 inch cleatrance between the pan and the steering gear housing, then remove pan and maybe do what you need to do with the oil control plunger. Without looking at my car, I would suspect if one were to disconnect the four (4) top shock mounting nuts, disconnect the sway bar bushing mount from the chasis that the whole subframe with suspension can be moved from under the engine area. 

Never did it, maybe others have. Or it may be a bigger pain in the a$$ than removing the engine???   :noidea:


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#10
wheel

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Pull the oil filter and inspect it for gold dust.  That will probably tell you all you need to know. 



#11
Bruce Wilson

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Is gold dust a bad thing?  I've certainly poured enough money in my motor to see a gold bar or two pop out the other end :D


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#12
wheel

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Actually bearing material is more valuable than gold dust, only if it isn't there.  How's that for twisted logic?

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I agree with Wheel on cutting the oil filter to check for bearing debris. If there is none and the oil sensor is okay (and I expect it is) ... and then if you're a gambler (and believe it's debris in the relief valve), fill the crankcase with really cheap 50 weight oil, start it up and give it a few seconds at ~3,000-4,000  RPM's and then look at the pressure gauge at idle. If you're living right that might just over travel the relief valve spring and clear whateverwas blocking it from seating. If it was mine I'd give it a rip!  

Good luck and if my idea kills your motor, I never suggested it.

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#14
Brian129

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It was cold when I unloaded it, but has been sitting in a heated warehouse so I may try it, hoping that it might move now.
We shall see tomorrow.

If it doesn't get off of zero, then I think I will pull it, as I could see a little puff of smoke out of the tail pipe on shifts. Seen in this video.

http://youtu.be/HGqs6mFgQy4

We shall see

#15
Brian129

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Well I got the motor out last night and got a look at the oil pump.
FF4684FA-7810-486A-B067-E49FE5493AFC.jpg
This is not what I had planned to be doing with this car since putting it together in January

But atleast I did find the issue, I hate taking things apart and not knowing what's wrong.
43AC778C-9A92-41A5-A922-FE39250D4EE6.jpg

The plunger was stuck hard!!! The bore was galled and very rough.
E567204C-323C-467B-B548-068247B05814.jpg

So as for how you can tell, the only way is when you have the pump in hand, take off the back cover, and peek through the hole, or to remove the cotter pin, and take the assembly out.
Basically, for the pain in the a$$ factor, just put a new pump on when you are doing any major work, and have the engine out. (If it's an old pump that is, this one lasted 24 years and 122,000 miles)

I have a trackday with the car on Friday. We shall see, I think I can make it, I already have pump replacement stuff, just missing a few gaskets for stuff I took off to get it out.
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#16
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Thank you for the follow-up/info.


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