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NASA vs. SCCA rules conflict

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#21
Chad Martin

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Why do you think FIA seats don't allow for back bracing?   Any seat can use back bracing if designed properly...



#22
RazerX

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I am glad both drivers are fine.  I was at the 25 and came by moments after the impact.  If anyone saw the Daytona 24 in 2014 with Memo, this was similar, you are at 90+ in this area.  The car was on the down slope after a rise into T14, so you can't see it clearly as a small rise obscures most of the car.  So tail lights are not visible.  I also was following a car, which pulled to the inside, which is exactly where you move to the inside to overtake going into the corner.  So as a following car you do not see the move as odd, by the time you realize there is a car there and in fact it is not moving you have very little time to react especially at night.  

 

I applaud the this thread and the focus on safety. 

 

There is no blame intended in this comment, and I myself am guilty, and I don't know if the driver had an option to do, but we(drivers) all need to ensure we move off the line and the track if we are experiencing mechanical issues.  Again this driver may not have had an option, not am I ensuating he did, but this is the 3rd crash in the last 12 months I have seen where a car was stopped on track and ultimately hit.  

 

Looking forward to meeting you, KW, at the 25 this year.  


 - Speed

 

 

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#23
Danny Steyn

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Mike Collins and I were involved in an 80 mph differential crash at Watkins Glenn in 2010. We were both very lucky. If it wasn't for David Lendrum's car in front ripping Collin's front wheel and converting it into a ramp allowing me to go airborne, all the energy from my car would have been transferred into Collin's car and who knows what the results would be. At the end of the slo-mo segment you can see the halo seat doing what it is supposed to do - containing my head's lateral movement. 

 

Even with 2400 lb cars, speed differentials make for terrifying accidents. Lets never forget how dangerous this sport really is, even in chick cars. Collins car was a total write off, mine was successfully repaired and raced very well thereafter. In fact the car is still competing to this day.

 


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#24
KW78

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I applaud the this thread and the focus on safety. 

 

There is no blame intended in this comment, and I myself am guilty, and I don't know if the driver had an option to do, but we(drivers) all need to ensure we move off the line and the track if we are experiencing mechanical issues.  Again this driver may not have had an option, not am I ensuating he did, but this is the 3rd crash in the last 12 months I have seen where a car was stopped on track and ultimately hit.  

 

Looking forward to meeting you, KW, at the 25 this year.  

 

This is a bit of an issue with me at this point.  The area at thunderhill had a week or two of heavy rain, and at the drivers meeting, we were instructed to not pull off track due to the mud.  It was emphasized with an anecdote of we will be sitting there alot longer if we get in the mud.  The ES equipment to that point of the event also did all of their work from the paved edge of the track.  For one car (miata) that went off in corner 2, a long way, it looked as if they winched out of the mud to the track to the tune of 50 yards (?) which was an extended yellow.  While Robert was the only accident from this, I personally saw 3 or 4 cars parked on the edge of the track during my driving stints, and a couple exactly where robert was stalled attempting to make pit in.   Ironically, the mud caused alot more full course yellows this year by complicating ES' answering of minor events, which caused alot of situations where cars were stuck on track out of fuel (pits closed for fuel during yellow). 

 

Hind sight being 20/20, there are alot of things to learn from this.  We as a team have analyzed what went on and how we can change to reduce the likeliness of a situation like this.  No less that a half dozen unusual issues piled up to cause this accident, not the least of which was the missing spotters tower we all came to depend on.  He was sitting there with lights on and flashers going. 

 

I also am penning suggestions to NASA eventually.

 

 

 

 

Why do you think FIA seats don't allow for back bracing?   Any seat can use back bracing if designed properly...

 

 

Chad,

 

Thanks for the cage reply!!  I am pretty good at reading rule books, but missed the CCR SM exception you noted.  I frankly have too many rulesets floating around in my head.  Some mornings I wake up and I am pretty sure that I can use the correct part number edlebrock head on the current SM build, and can dry sump the motor with a 50# weight penalty. 

 

The FIA seat brace debate is from a few (5?) years ago.  I believe that it was SCCA's tech department take was that the FIA rating was achieved with a seat designed to absorb energy as a unit, and a back brace when the seat does not call for it (most do not) changes that design, so technically the FIA rating should be revoked.  Drilling holes in the seat for a brace is another issue as well that changes the construction of the seat.   That doesn't make the seat illegal, as any rigid seat with a back brace is legal (no fia or SFI rating required).  What is fairly idiotic, is the notion that the seat expires, so to keep it in the car you have to drill holes and install a back brace.  I believe nasa arrived at allowing a back brace without it being required to bolt to the seat, in order to address this. 

 

There are a couple FIA seats that allow/require a back brace, and we are using one of those in the latest build.

 

Kyle


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#25
Dave D.

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NASA's rules don't say to drill holes in the FIA composite seat for the back brace. The brace is to butt up against the back of the seat with a surface of sufficient load bearing area to spread the load.


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#26
john mueller

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Mini-Hijack...  NASA 2015 SM Rules have been posted.  I've been the delay in getting this done.  There should be, specific to SM very very few differences.  If you find one, besides tires, please IM or email me.

 

 

 

 

 


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