26 replies to this topic

[Johnny D]

Hoosier will make us a thinner tire, like a 195. Collins recommended that a few years ago and Hoosier was on board when I looked into it.

Jim bought it up earlier... the cars would be ALOT closer on skinnier tires. The 205 Hoosier is bigger than a 225 Toyo. The current Hoosier tire is an exceptional value, for those of you that want the glory days of Toyo you are fooling yourself. I run SSM on Toyo's as well as SM and use one set per weekend shaved to within a gnats ass of its life to run up front...

Hoosier needs to make us a 195.

[Johnny D]

I guess both clubs running on RR's would be too much to ask for.
J~

[Tom Sager]

JD, can you make this thread a survey?  

[Johnny D]

IDK, I'm a virgin survey maker. Let me see.

J~

[Jim Drago]

I guess both clubs running on RR's would be too much to ask for.
J~

We shave these as well, ask anyone at the NASA champs.

Also, Hoosier would need to sell off all old tires, but were willing, so it would like be a 6-12 month transition.

[Johnny D]

We shave these as well, ask anyone at the NASA champs.

Also, Hoosier would need to sell off all old tires, but were willing, so it would like be a 6-12 month transition.

I know. Shaving wasn't the topic really.
J~

[Johnny D]

JD, can you make this thread a survey?

I see how from a new one, not a modification, unless Jim has the magic touch.

What did you have in mind...
J~

[Tom Sager]

Maybe this in a survey....

 

Would you support a change to a 195/50-15 size tire of the same brand and model?  Yes or no

Do you feel this change would reduce wear and tear on suspension components? Yes or no

Do you feel this change would improve parity among the different model year cars?  Yes or no

What model year car do you drive  (select from list)

Do you primarily compete in SCCA or NASA?

[Johnny D]

If we do this please give us time to use up what we have.

but

This should be discussed further. 1) i hope a smaller tire would be cheaper 2) we have several issues that crop up regarding the excessive grip we get with the Hoosier, front hubs fail, Rear Hubs fail, even more now, and we are seeing hubs front and rear crack and come apart. I have had those failures too.

We are seeing transmission failures that could be compounded, by excessive grip, downshifting too soon, and blasting 3rd gear.

I am not an expert on if the smaller tire would make us closer on parity, but we do not need the level of grip that we have. I assume the tire would last as long or they could engineer it to last as long.

I think this needs to be put on the table.

[Johnny D]

Maybe this in a survey....
 
Would you support a change to a 195/50-15 size tire of the same brand and model?  Yes or no
Do you feel this change would reduce wear and tear on suspension components? Yes or no
Do you feel this change would improve parity among the different model year cars?  Yes or no
What model year car do you drive  (select from list)
Do you primarily compete in SCCA or NASA?

I did a poll, it only has 3 questions.
J~

[Johnny D]

Couldn't possibly agree with this more..... I was not aware that it was ever on the table.....

- Reduced hub and bearing failure
- Makes the driver manage the car/tires throughout the entire race
- Potential reduction of destroying 3rd gear in the transmissions
- Overall height reduction (and possible weight) which helps the 1.6L

Sean

[LarryKing]

SCCA going back to Toyo would sure make things easier/less expensive for the folks who crossover to NASA.

 

How many heat cycles can you get out of a Toyo RR? I know the big budget Dilberts will shave them down until it's a one race tire, but how about for budget racers? How many heat cycle on a new un-shaved RR before they fall off? With the SM7 after 10-12 HCs there is a major drop off.

[FTodaro]

SCCA going back to Toyo would sure make things easier/less expensive for the folks who crossover to NASA.

 

How many heat cycles can you get out of a Toyo RR? I know the big budget Dilberts will shave them down until it's a one race tire, but how about for budget racers? How many heat cycle on a new un-shaved RR before they fall off? With the SM7 after 10-12 HCs there is a major drop off.

That is a track dependent question. Mid O is not the norm. but at the O bald skin RR's are the fastest. a full tread RR is about a second or more off the pace and at our track you can grain them easy so IMO the Hoosier's harder compound is a better buy as it does not grain and is race ready as a sticker. RR's have to be shaved or you have to put lots of laps on them before you can race them hard with out graining. Would rather have the Hoosier.

[ECOBRAP]

SCCA going back to Toyo would sure make things easier/less expensive for the folks who crossover to NASA.

 

How many heat cycles can you get out of a Toyo RR? I know the big budget Dilberts will shave them down until it's a one race tire, but how about for budget racers? How many heat cycle on a new un-shaved RR before they fall off? With the SM7 after 10-12 HCs there is a major drop off.

 

As I posted in the poll thread, I have used 18+ HC tires and been at the front of the pack, same times as stickers. Just way harder to drive the more HC's they have.

 

I think the most HC's I recorded on RR's were around 21, then I chickened out of my experiment and got a new set. Shoutout to Toyo for making such an amazing tire.

[ChrisA]

SCCA going back to Toyo would sure make things easier/less expensive for the folks who crossover to NASA.

 

 

Or NASA could switch to Hoosier. Their track side support is a BIG plus.

[Johnny D]

Or NASA could switch to Hoosier. Their track side support is a BIG plus.

Have you been drinking ???   (avatar)

Just a FYI both clubs have multi year contracts that renew different years.

 

Who's up for renewal 1st ??

 

And different regions have different support from both MFGs.

J~

[Caveman-kwebb99]

As I posted in the poll thread, I have used 18+ HC tires and been at the front of the pack, same times as stickers. Just way harder to drive the more HC's they have.

 

I think the most HC's I recorded on RR's were around 21, then I chickened out of my experiment and got a new set. Shoutout to Toyo for making such an amazing tire.

 

I ran 18+ hc tires last year at mid ohio regional and ran up front also, fail to see your point!  If its a deep field and  everyone was on stickers you would need stickers, if only a couple are on stickers when the field is not so deep you can still be semi competitive, very few tracks like old tires, 18+ would not be the tire at road america or road atlanta, or most other tracks!  

 

 

if you shave the toyo down to 2/32 or 1/32 at most tracks you not going to get 20hc anyway...  Nobody is shaving the hoosier, they are competitive for 5-7hc max, i dont believe a shaved toyo is good for any more then that at the majority of tracks.

 

If you want to beat a Mark Drennan your not going to do that on old ass tires end of discussion!!!!

 

Personally I am happy with the 205 hoosier, we all have it pretty much figured out now why go back to have to figure out a new tire?????

[Johnny D]

Wow, maybe just you typing fast caveman, a lot of incorrect info there.

 

Mid-o like old tires. So big deal.

 

Nobody is shaving Hoosiers, please!!!

 

Matt ^^ just beat Mark last time out on Toyo's. Will have to see how many HC he was on.

 

J~

[JRHille]

Toyos are very track dependent. It was a pain in the ass to get the right tire at mid Ohio. Most of the time, new ones would grain and they were almost a second off the pace. At gingerman or Putnam a sticker set would be worth almost a second.
The Hoosier has been much more consistent track to track, and the contingency is better. If lap times are similar id be in favor of 195 Hoosier for both organizations.

[Ron Alan]

 

If you want to beat a Mark Drennan your not going to do that on old ass tires end of discussion!!!!

 

 

Mr Webb...I will point out that Mr Cresci did say he ran the same times on old tires as new...kind of a relevant point dont you think? 

 

And to Mark D. credit, he is running Toyos until at least 1 has no lines or his help yells at him! And many are following suit in the West! Not a significant drop at any of our tracks.