Scary to racing future. EPA to shut down racing.
#1
Posted 02-08-2016 10:05 PM
#2
Posted 02-08-2016 10:51 PM
#3
Posted 02-09-2016 07:13 AM
#4
Posted 02-09-2016 08:36 AM
#5
Posted 02-09-2016 10:26 AM
So the regulation would prohibit street cars from being converted to race cars not meeting EPA emissions standards but it doesn't prohibit purpose built race cars. So NASCAR and other pro series won't be subject to the same rules. No big surprise there.
#6
Posted 02-09-2016 11:29 AM
Fact: the Clean Air Act **ALREADY** prohibited the removal, alteration/tampering, or installation of defeat devices to emission control devices on cars that were originally installed with them. Guess what? If you built a race car from a street car that originally had emission control devices on it and removed them, you were already in violation of the Clean Air Act. The EPA already has enough things to monitor and enforce, so let's just say when it comes to race cars, they look the other way. It is not much of a reality to enforce this.
This does not need to turn into a political conversation, but as a reminder, our U.S. Congress was responsible for creating and enacting the Clean Air Act, not the EPA.
Let's carry on and get back to building, prepping, and talking smack.
Jon Yanca
2003 SM
Former cars:
2010 MX-5 T4
2001 SM
1996 SM
#7
Posted 02-09-2016 11:39 AM
#8
Posted 02-09-2016 12:38 PM
Everyone, please calm down. Like so many things these days, this is another case of the media (or SEMA) not knowing all the facts and hyping a situation for good headlines. Nothing has actually changed or is changing from how the law is currently written. Recently, the EPA needed to clarify some language to defining an "on-road" vehicle for the purpose of some upcoming changes to "heavy-duty" on-road vehicle standards. THEY ARE NOT TRYING TO TAKE AWAY OR PREVENT FUTURE RACE CARS!
Fact: the Clean Air Act **ALREADY** prohibited the removal, alteration/tampering, or installation of defeat devices to emission control devices on cars that were originally installed with them. Guess what? If you built a race car from a street car that originally had emission control devices on it and removed them, you were already in violation of the Clean Air Act. The EPA already has enough things to monitor and enforce, so let's just say when it comes to race cars, they look the other way. It is not much of a reality to enforce this.
This does not need to turn into a political conversation, but as a reminder, our U.S. Congress was responsible for creating and enacting the Clean Air Act, not the EPA.
Let's carry on and get back to building, prepping, and talking smack.
You act like the EPA doesn't continually over reach their authority and the scope of the Clean Air Act and the Clean Water Act. The EPA is continually looking to expand its reach by implementing new guidelines forcing industry to file suit if congress isn't alerted to the damage financial and otherwise the new guidelines could cause. Wetland regulations is out of control and the US Army Corps of Engineers and the EPA have almost every law suit filed when the aggressively interpret the CWA, unfortunately it takes about a decade to get your case heard and if the court flips in the next few years the over reaching will become even more prevalent as their won't be anyone to over rule them.
- Sean - MiataCage and av8tor like this
#9
Posted 02-09-2016 12:40 PM
Everyone, please calm down. Like so many things these days, this is another case of the media (or SEMA) not knowing all the facts and hyping a situation for good headlines. Nothing has actually changed or is changing from how the law is currently written. Recently, the EPA needed to clarify some language to defining an "on-road" vehicle for the purpose of some upcoming changes to "heavy-duty" on-road vehicle standards. THEY ARE NOT TRYING TO TAKE AWAY OR PREVENT FUTURE RACE CARS!
Fact: the Clean Air Act **ALREADY** prohibited the removal, alteration/tampering, or installation of defeat devices to emission control devices on cars that were originally installed with them. Guess what? If you built a race car from a street car that originally had emission control devices on it and removed them, you were already in violation of the Clean Air Act. The EPA already has enough things to monitor and enforce, so let's just say when it comes to race cars, they look the other way. It is not much of a reality to enforce this.
This does not need to turn into a political conversation, but as a reminder, our U.S. Congress was responsible for creating and enacting the Clean Air Act, not the EPA.
Let's carry on and get back to building, prepping, and talking smack.
What do you know?! You apparently race Camaros (with the number 67, no less!), and therefore clearly can't be trusted. You're probably an EPA plant sent to convince us to look the other way while the EPA quietly takes away our God-given freedoms!
- dstevens and av8tor like this
-tch
Build: www.tomhampton.info
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I didn't lose, I just got outspent!
#10
Posted 02-09-2016 12:47 PM
Some of you boys foil is wrapped a bit too tight..
on edit:
This is a part from within the 600 plus page doc clarifiying the role of the regs with regards to non street legal race vehicles. This is directed toward street legal race cars. Emphasis mine, from a piece this morning on Jalopnic http://jalopnik.com/...cars-1758013542
Competition engines/equipment: (i) For uncertified engines/equipment that are excluded or exempted as new engines/equipment from any requirements of this chapter because they are to be used solely for competition, you may not use any of them in a manner that is inconsistent with use solely for competition.
Do your own research, think for yourself. SEMA is hoping your anti big brother streak is going to drive you into a frenzy without fully understanding the scope of the situation. SEMA members make a shit load of money with non compliant mods and parts.
Edited by dstevens, 02-09-2016 01:04 PM.
- Graeme likes this
#11
Posted 02-09-2016 01:42 PM
Some of you boys foil is wrapped a bit too tight..
on edit:
This is a part from within the 600 plus page doc clarifiying the role of the regs with regards to non street legal race vehicles. This is directed toward street legal race cars. Emphasis mine, from a piece this morning on Jalopnic http://jalopnik.com/...cars-1758013542
Do your own research, think for yourself. SEMA is hoping your anti big brother streak is going to drive you into a frenzy without fully understanding the scope of the situation. SEMA members make a shit load of money with non compliant mods and parts.
Don't know about the actual language in this latest publication but the EPA is not our friend.
- Justin Casey and av8tor like this
#12
Posted 02-09-2016 02:14 PM
Don't know about the actual language in this latest publication but the EPA is not our friend.
We can all agree with that......
#13
Posted 02-09-2016 03:05 PM
The EPA already has enough things to monitor and enforce, so let's just say when it comes to race cars, they look the other way. It is not much of a reality to enforce this.
This sounds a lot to me like STR gate.... "No no, I swear it's legal and even if it wasn't tech has already seen it for the last 7 years at the Sprints and Runoffs and they are choosing not to do anything about it."
The written rule/law is what matters and you nor anyone else can predict what someone may choose to enforce in the future. I have not read the entire thing yet, but it appears as though there is lots of language that contradicts itself with other things that are not even defined. Lois Lerner comes to mind here..... Maybe we get someone in charge who doesn't like race cars and now we are a target. Not probable at all, but certainly possible.
I don't think the sky is falling, nor do I think that anything will come of this, but I personally believe (no offense Camaro67) banking on a Gov't employee or entity to not do something because it goes against common sense is a dangerous bet and one I would not be willing to take.
Sean
- 38bfast likes this
www.miatacage.com
360-606-7734
#14
Posted 02-09-2016 03:10 PM
Don't know about the actual language in this latest publication but the EPA is not our friend.
If you don't know then how are you to make in informed comment on the matter?
We can all agree with that......
For whom are you speaking?
The AQMD makes the EPA look like choir boys. Before you guys lose your shit and go occupy a wildlife sanctuary, inform yourself as to what's actually happening and what the real impact would be. Follow the money.
- CruzanTom likes this
#15
Posted 02-09-2016 04:28 PM
Getting a bit off-topic but the EPA has a lot of enemies, some of which are not/should not be your friends either.
http://www.publicint...toxic-chemicals
Tom
Tom Hart
#44 SM and T-4
2014 SC Driver of the Year
2015 SE Championship Series Spec Miata Champion
2016 SE Championship Series Spec Miata Champion
#16
Posted 02-09-2016 05:27 PM
YOU NOT TAKIN AWAY MY RACIN GUBMENT
- Alex Piku and Danica Davison like this
1999 Spec Miata
Hilltrux - Roush - V2 Motorsports - ESR
#17
Posted 02-09-2016 05:29 PM
#18
Posted 02-09-2016 05:35 PM
We'd all be forced into these. Oh, the horror.
https://www.flyinmia...tfish/index.php
J~
#19
Posted 02-09-2016 05:53 PM
You are missing the point. They already have the authority because technically we are in violation having removed emissions devices. There is no new news. Let's just hope it all goes away and the EPA continues to ignore what we do like they have been. I'm most worried that this big stink that was raised will then force the EPA's hand to actually do something. There's always someone who has to be a hero.You act like the EPA doesn't continually over reach their authority and the scope of the Clean Air Act and the Clean Water Act. The EPA is continually looking to expand its reach by implementing new guidelines forcing industry to file suit if congress isn't alerted to the damage financial and otherwise the new guidelines could cause. Wetland regulations is out of control and the US Army Corps of Engineers and the EPA have almost every law suit filed when the aggressively interpret the CWA, unfortunately it takes about a decade to get your case heard and if the court flips in the next few years the over reaching will become even more prevalent as their won't be anyone to over rule them.
- dstevens likes this
Jon Yanca
2003 SM
Former cars:
2010 MX-5 T4
2001 SM
1996 SM
#20
Posted 02-09-2016 08:13 PM
This sounds a lot to me like STR gate.... "No no, I swear it's legal and even if it wasn't tech has already seen it for the last 7 years at the Sprints and Runoffs and they are choosing not to do anything about it."
The written rule/law is what matters and you nor anyone else can predict what someone may choose to enforce in the future. I have not read the entire thing yet, but it appears as though there is lots of language that contradicts itself with other things that are not even defined. Lois Lerner comes to mind here..... Maybe we get someone in charge who doesn't like race cars and now we are a target. Not probable at all, but certainly possible.
I don't think the sky is falling, nor do I think that anything will come of this, but I personally believe (no offense Camaro67) banking on a Gov't employee or entity to not do something because it goes against common sense is a dangerous bet and one I would not be willing to take.
Sean
You obviously aren't drinking enough Oregon water Sean!
Ron
RAmotorsports
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