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#1
TrentO

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I'm not sure what the situation is in the rest of the world, but in Canada it is getting hard to source hardtops for the cars.  Since you can run without the top, which essentially removes the weigh from the equation, would allowing lightweight (and cheaper) hardtops make sense?  I see Mazda Motorsports is now offering a lightweight hardtop for other classes.

 

 



#2
Justin Casey

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Here in CA, I wouldn't say they are scarce but prices are averaging about $1000 USD.

 

It could be an option in the future, but I think it would take away the originality of the class concept, which Mazda disapproves of IMO.


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#3
Sean - MiataCage

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Someone please submit a letter and we can take up the topic. I personally see some future value in allowing this to happen if done properly. When was the last time tech ever checked a hard top. I've never seen it, but other areas may check for it. If it is good for the overall class then I am sure Mazda would support it.

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#4
Mark

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1000.00 all day long for an OEM top and you have to race to get it here in SoCal now that summer is almost over. The d*mn top almost costs as much as the donor car these days. Donor car prices have fallen a bit but the hard top prices have stayed the same for years now.


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#5
Johnny D

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$849 + freight

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#6
davew

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This was debated years ago by the SMAC and we voted against anything except oem tops. reasons:

 

They are still available new from Mazda. Expensive but available

They are still fairly findable on the used market. Been $1000 +/- for many years now

Most aftermarket tops are lighter than oem. Thus an advantage

Most aftermaket tops do not work with factory glass. Only bolt in plastic windows.

 

The NC aftermarket top was allowed in T4 for the following reasons:

Virtually unavailable on the used market as it was not a popular option

$2300 for new from Mazda

Aftermarket top acceptable in SCCA Pro World Challenge. With an additional 20 pound weight penalty over oem top. T4 has the same weight penalty.

Aftermarket top available from Mazda for $900 IIRC

 

dave


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#7
FTodaro

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I think its worthy of a review. It is getting harder to find used tops the price keeps creeping up. If not a problem today, it will be at some point. Also, while we are talking about it, what would be the harm of running no rear window, if we are allowed to run with an open top? Just asking the question. The weight issue to me is close to a non issue, Yes relevant in theory but not likely a practical difference.


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#8
davew

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I don't remember the exact situation, but was determined years ago that running with the hardtop but without a window was not legal.


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#9
Mark

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Big issue regarding running without the hardtop is that the cage must meet the 2" clearance requirement for open top cars aka the 'broomstick rule'. Building the cage tall enough in the miata to meet this requirement usually means that a hardtop will not fit. The new floor allowance may have changed this limitation somewhat. 


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#10
Danica Davison

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I definitely think it is worth talking about.  I think the same thing goes with the front spoilers. Jim is the only one who can make one now?  I would say if it is the same aero, shape, and weight ... it shouldn't matter ... for both the hard top and the front spoiler.  Weight and measurements are pretty easy to tech.


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#11
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 :scratchchin:   Options:

 

If supply is short and expensive for hard tops and lip spoilers, change the rules, illegal to use either.


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#12
Johnny D

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http://cdn.growasset....pdf?1471879991

 

SCCA Fastrack News
September 2016
Page 17
CLUB RACING TECHNICAL BULLETIN

 

Spec Miata
1. #19050 (John Bauer) Bore/Overbore Dimensions Conflict
In GCR section 9.1.7.C.1.b., add the following language:
“1. The engine block may be decked/milled to achieve the factory specified compression ratio for the correct
model year as listed. Honing of cylinders is permitted to a maximum standard diameter as shown in
Table 1.
the
SM Spec Lines.
(REMOVE TABLE)
2. [no changes]
3. The cylinders may be bored .010” over to a maximum overbore
(“alternate”)
diameter shown in
table 2.
the
SM Spec Lines.
(REMOVE TABLE)

SCCA Fastrack News
September 2016
Page 20
In SM, Change Spec Lines for bore as follows:
FROM
90-93:
78.0/78.25 (3.071/3.081)
94-05:
83.0/83.25 (3.268/3.278)
TO
90-93:
78.13mm/78.38mm (3.076”/3.086”)
94-05:
83.13mm/83.39mm (3.273”/3.283”)
2. #19659 (Chris Lefferdink) Please Change GCR section 9.1.7.C.6.c (Page 769)
In GCR section 9.1.7.C.6.c., add the following language:
“The “R” package Miata chin spoiler is allowed on 1990-1997 cars provided it is mounted in the OEM location.
1999-up cars may use the OEM chin spoiler for these cars (99-00 p/n: NC10- V4-900F or 01-05 p/n: NO67-V4-
900G). 
Aftermarket chin spoilers may be used but must use the same mounting holes, must have the same
dimensions and must perform only the same functions as the OEM chin spoiler. Any material may be used.


3. #20046 (Spec Miata Committee) subsection rulebook clarification
In GCR section 9.1.7.C.1.o.3., make the following change:
“All sensors related to engine operating parameters must be used and must be stock Mazda parts. These
sensors and their locations and mounts, and their wiring harness leads may not be altered except as allowed in
subsection
6
9
below. Any sensors required for analog type gauges must be in addition to the Mazda sensors.
Data acquisition sensors may be added. Relocating the oil pressure sending in order to install an oil pressure
gauge is permitted. On 96-05 cars a single fixed bracket may be installed to support and secure the crank position
sensor (CPS) in its stock location. The bracket may only attach to the CPS, the CPS mounting bolt, and the closest
oil pump threaded mounting hole and must serve no other purpose.”


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#13
Frederic Scott

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Hi, new guy here.  I guess this is my official introduction.

 

I'm building a spec Miata, and I ran across this thread while researching the legality of a Snugtop hardtop.

 

2016 rules state "Hardtop may be used, and if used, must be securely bolted in place. Aftermarket hard tops are allowed provided they meet the exact original equipment specifications for both design and weight"

 

This language was a little vague with regards to design, so I called up NASA and spoke to Will Faules, the regional director for Texas.  He confirmed that the intent of the rule is to allow aftermarket tops, so long as they are the same shape as, and don't weigh less than, the OEM top.

 

A lightweight carbon fiber top isn't allowed.  But a Snugtop, which is reported to weigh slightly more than the OEM top, is legal.

 

Cheers,

Frederic



#14
Chris Lefferdink

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2. #19659 (Chris Lefferdink) Please Change GCR section 9.1.7.C.6.c (Page 769)
In GCR section 9.1.7.C.6.c., add the following language:
“The “R” package Miata chin spoiler is allowed on 1990-1997 cars provided it is mounted in the OEM location.
1999-up cars may use the OEM chin spoiler for these cars (99-00 p/n: NC10- V4-900F or 01-05 p/n: NO67-V4-
900G). 
Aftermarket chin spoilers may be used but must use the same mounting holes, must have the same
dimensions and must perform only the same functions as the OEM chin spoiler. Any material may be used.

 

:cheers:


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#15
Johnny D

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Welcome Frederic, not a big debate going on, IMO. Ave price is $1k for OEM or Snugtop, there around, not real short supply

Mazda got there lighter one for $849+freight, not sure what carbon fiber is going for. not a hugh savings there.

So I don't see a rule change coming any time soon.

J~

 

You guys need to check the Fastrack every month or I need to spell everything out for you guys I guess. The chin spoiler was posted a week or 2 ago.


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#16
Rob Burgoon

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Might need to take some sort of steps against a ultralight shell with weights down low in its backside.  Not sure what those steps would be, but that's how I would exploit such a rule.


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#17
Johnny D

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When was the last time tech ever checked a hard top. I've never seen it, but other areas may check for it.

Sean

 

So how many cheater tops will be at the runoffs and how many will you catch ?  :pimp: 

J~


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#18
davew

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There should be no cheater hardtops at the Runoffs. SCCA does NOT ALLOW the snugtop or any other top for that matter.

 

Note that the snugtop does not use the same latches as the oem units. The typical brackets that we all use will not work.


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#19
Johnny D

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There should be no cheater hardtops at the Runoffs. SCCA does NOT ALLOW the snugtop or any other top for that matter.

 

Note that the snugtop does not use the same latches as the oem units. The typical brackets that we all use will not work.

 

Good to note. I was suggesting an OEM modified / lightened. Is there a min weight req'd ? Ok to sand/round edges around window, etc.?

Other thoughts were for Daytona or Indy has the windshield been tilted back for better aero and top shortened at the front/height.

Not that anyone would do that. :whistling:

J~


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#20
davew

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IIDNSYCYCN


Dave Wheeler
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