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2017 seat mounting rules

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#1
Mark McCallister

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I guess I wasn't keeping up with my FastTracks, but it looks like the final 2017 rule got simplified to:

 

The driver’s seat shall be a one-piece bucket-type seat and shall be securely mounted, so as to provide fore/aft and lateral support. Passenger seat back, if a folding seat, shall be securely bolted or strapped in place.

 

I think that's excellent, I was not a fan of the previous proposal that got into the weeds on FIA homologation expiration, back braces arbitrarily required on seats not designed for them, etc.  <thumbs up>  

 

-Mark

 


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#2
FTodaro

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can we get NASA on the same page?


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#3
Dirk Johnson

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So 1st can we get the section this ^ came out of ? And what else is there ?  Is this ^ going to be a rewrite ?

 

2nd, SCCA may want to get on board with NASA, in the HPDE section they point out that most passenger folding seat (like the vague mentioned above) are not fire retardant (foam etc)and need to match the requirements. FIA etc.

 

And use plate to reinforce them.

 

Here you go. I'll post some pieces.

https://nasa-assets..../282/2016.9.pdf


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#4
Dirk Johnson

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HPDE section 11.4.12
Seats
All seats must be securely fastened to the structure of the car such that they are strong
enough to withstand a major  impact.  
If  replaced,  the  replacement  seat  should  be  installed  according  to  the  manufacturer’s
instructions. Expired FIA  seats  may  be  used  in  HPDE  without  a  seat  back  brace  if  one
was not  required originally. If  stock  seats  are  to  be  used  with  a  roll  bar/cage,  care  should  be  taken  to  prevent  the  seat  from  submarining
under  the roll  bar.  Care  should also be  taken  to  prevent  the  occupant  from  hitting  his/her  head
on  the  roll bar/cage. Passenger  seats  must  meet  the  same minimum requirements
,  per  the  CCR, as  the  driver  seat,  if  used  by passengers.
Note-
The passenger seat does not have to match the driver’s seat.

 

15.16
Driver’s Seat
The driver’s seat must be securely fastened and braced in such a way as to minimize the possibility of breaking
loose  during  an  impact.    L
arge  fender  washers  and  solid  fabricated  mounts  are  recommended.    Seats  made
primarily of plastic, PVC, ABS, or other similar polymers are strictly prohibited.  The installation of the seat must
conform to all requirements published by the manufacturer.

 

15.16.1
Racing Seat
Some  series  require  an  approved  racing  seat.    It  is  strongly  recommend  that  a  racing  seat  be  installed  in  all
vehicles.  A racing seat is of solid design; not “tube and cloth” designs commonly found in passenger cars.
It can  be  very  difficult  to  properly  brace  a  “tube  and  cloth”  type  seat  and  the  vehicle  may  not  pass  technical
inspection.  Additionally, the cloth or material on a “stock” seat is typically not flame retardant.  Therefore, the
proper installation of a racing seat is strongly recommended.

 

15.16.2
Seat Mounting
The  seat  shall be  mounted  to  a  steel  floor  pan  with  reinforcements.    A  reinforcement  structure  should  be
fabricated with a minimum thickness of 0.090” for those vehicles without a steel floor pan.  The reinforcement
structure should be mounted to (or within) the steel frame / chassis / cage members.


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#5
mdavis

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When did it change back?  


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#6
Mark McCallister

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The new-new text is in the August and September Fastracks, I'm not sure when exactly it was initially published.

 

The PDFs are here: https://www.scca.com...s/fastrack-news.  (Page 5 of the September issue)


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#7
Dirk Johnson

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The new-new text is in the August and September Fastracks, I'm not sure when exactly it was initially published.

 

The PDFs are here: https://www.scca.com...s/fastrack-news.  (Page 5 of the September issue)

 

Everyone cool with that?

J~

 

Recommended wording in July Fastrack:
The driver’s seat shall be a one-piece bucket-type seat and shall be securely mounted, so as to provide fore/aft and lateral
support. Seats that have been homologated to and mounted in accordance with FIA
standard 8855-1999, or seats that have
been certified to FIA. Standard.8862-2009 or higher may be mounted on runners only if they were part of the FIA
homologated
seats assembly specified in an FIA homologated race car. The homologation labels must be visible. Seat supports shall be
of the type listed on FIA technical list No.12 or No. 40 (lateral, bottom, etc). Passenger seat back, if a folding seat, it shall be
securely bolted or strapped in place.

 
(August 2016 Fastrack) The CRB recommends an updated version of this rule change, to be effective 1/1/2017.
Please note that this recommended rule change has been modified several times as a result of member input and comments.
The CRB has included all of the changes that resulted in the final recommendation.

 

The driver’s seat shall be a one-piece bucket-type seat and shall be securely mounted, so as to provide fore/aft and lateral
support. Passenger seat back, if a folding seat, shall be securely bolted or strapped in place.


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#8
Mark McCallister

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How does the saying go, have a 5 bucket butt, buy a 5 buck bucket?


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#9
MotoFusi

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Everyone cool with that?

J~

 

Recommended wording in July Fastrack:
The driver’s seat shall be a one-piece bucket-type seat and shall be securely mounted, so as to provide fore/aft and lateral
support. Seats that have been homologated to and mounted in accordance with FIA
standard 8855-1999, or seats that have
been certified to FIA. Standard.8862-2009 or higher may be mounted on runners only if they were part of the FIA
homologated
seats assembly specified in an FIA homologated race car. The homologation labels must be visible. Seat supports shall be
of the type listed on FIA technical list No.12 or No. 40 (lateral, bottom, etc). Passenger seat back, if a folding seat, it shall be
securely bolted or strapped in place.

 
(August 2016 Fastrack) The CRB recommends an updated version of this rule change, to be effective 1/1/2017.
Please note that this recommended rule change has been modified several times as a result of member input and comments.
The CRB has included all of the changes that resulted in the final recommendation.

 

The driver’s seat shall be a one-piece bucket-type seat and shall be securely mounted, so as to provide fore/aft and lateral
support. Passenger seat back, if a folding seat, shall be securely bolted or strapped in place.

 

HMMM, most aluminum seats are bolted together. By strict definition not a one piece.


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#10
Bench Racer

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HMMM, most aluminum seats are bolted together. By strict definition not a one piece.

OR, would the bolt on items be options???


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#11
mlabouff

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While having my SM tech'd (SCCA) for the 2017 season I was informed that that GCR changed and I now need a seat back brace for my expired Spacro Pro ADV seat. I can not find this requirement in the current GCR and it looks to be counter to the information in this topic. Anyone aware of this new requirement?



#12
wheel

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After the initial change, member feedback caused two re-writes of the seat rule.  Here is the final:

 

9.3.40. SEATS

The driver’s seat shall be a one-piece bucket-type seat and shall be securely mounted, so as to provide fore/aft and lateral support. Passenger seat back, if a folding seat, shall be securely bolted or strapped in place. 

 

So, the answer is that the tech person did not see the new rule.  If your seat is firmly mounted, it is good to the technical regulations.  If the guy doing your annual can wobble it around, it won't pass tech.  Also, remember that it is your ass in that seat, so make sure it is securely mounted.


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#13
Alberto

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Copy / Paste of the additional paragraphs from the Feb 2017 GCR page 107:

 

9.3.40. SEATS

The driver’s seat shall be a one-piece bucket-type seat and shall be se- curely mounted, so as to provide fore/aft and lateral support. Passenger seat back, if a folding seat, shall be securely bolted or strapped in place.

Mounting structures for racing seats may attach to the floor, cage and or center tunnel. Seat mounting points forward of the main hoop, between the center line of the car and the driver’s side door bar and rearward of the front edge of the seat bottom are not considered cage attachment points in classes with limitations on the number of attachments.

A system of head rest to prevent whiplash and rebound, and also to pre- vent the driver’s head from striking the underside of the main hoop shall be installed on all vehicles. Racing seats with integral headrests satisfy this requirement.

The head rest on non-integral seats shall have a minimum area of 36 square inches and be padded with a minimum of one inch thick padding. It is strongly recommended that padding meet SFI spec 45.2 or FIA Sports Car Head Rest Material. The head rest shall be capable of withstanding a force of two-hundred (200) lbs. in a rearward direction. The head rest support shall be such that it continues rearward or upward from the top edge in a way that the driver’s helmet can not hook over the pad. 

 

So it seems like seats no longer require SFI or FIA homologation nor do they "expire" or require a seat back brace.  Is that correct?  If not, please direct me to where homologation and expiration is specified.

 

Thanks.


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#14
wheel

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The rule is very simple.   There is no other rule.  Read the rule and comply.  Homologation and expiration are not in the rule.   THIS IS THE RULE:

 

The driver’s seat shall be a one-piece bucket-type seat and shall be securely mounted, so as to provide fore/aft and lateral support.



#15
wheel

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Of course, the entire rule applies as it pertains to the head rest, etc.  the rest is as you have posted it.



#16
davew

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Playing devils advocate here:

 

Is a typical aluminum seat, (that is several pieces of sheet aluminum welded together) considered a one-piece bucket-type seat?

 

If the aluminum seat is securely fastened, does this new wording eliminate the requirement for a seat back brace?


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#17
FTodaro

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For what its worth, the SCCA rule is the way to go for club racing. My $1000.00 sparco circuit pro should last as long as i do in racing and putting brace behind does little to improve safety, and could just cause unintended harm. Do not agree with the NASA bracing rule if its still on the books. Just speaking from from my experience in mounting a big seat in a miata, its already braced by the tight fit between the cage.

 

By the way i have crash tested this theory.


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#18
wheel

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There is no requirement for any seat other than it shall be securely mounted, so as to provide fore/aft and lateral support



#19
Bench Racer

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Some high roller seats TODAY have a brace/bolts/attached behind the seat. Things are learned as we move forward. As someone previously suggested, it's your a$$ in the seat.


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