Jump to content

Photo

gusseted rear diff housings


  • Please log in to reply
44 replies to this topic

#21
Bench Racer

Bench Racer

    Different strokes for different folks : )

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,620 posts
  • Location:Wauwatosa, WI
  • Region:Milwaukee
  • Car Year:1990
  • Car Number:14

Had the CaveMan diff. previously in other races/qualifying been involved in bump drafting?


Broken record - You are starting to sound like a broken record. Donor - Made PayPal donation Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver

#22
davew

davew

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,135 posts
  • Location:Beloit, Wi
  • Region:Chicago
  • Car Year:1999
  • Car Number:72

For those of you worried about legality, this has been legal for many years. I wrote a letter and requested a definitive answer. That is when the words about trans and diff housings was added to the rule quoted above.

 

Been legal since begining of SM by "industry standard repair"

Specificly made legal by my letter and change in wording many years ago.

Not a performance advantage.

Not a slippery slope to prod rules.

Many of you just did not know about the rule or the problem. 

 

Jim, being a business man, is simply making the part available to those of you who can not weld aluminum. And at a reasonable price. Look up a new one, close to $1000. Even used are in the $300 range.

 

Dave


  • dstevens and Danica Davison like this

Dave Wheeler
Advanced Autosports, the nations most complete Spec Miata shop
Author, Spec Miata Constructors Guide, version 1 and 2.0

Building Championship winning cars since 1995

3 time consecutive Central DIvision Champion car builder 2012-2013-2014

2014 SCCA Majors National point Champion car builder

2014 SCCA Northern Conference Champion car builder, Spec Miata (Burdzy) and T4 (Bender)

2014 SCCA Runoffs winner, T4 (Bender)

2014 Central Division Champion, ITS (Wheeler)

2013 Thunderhill 25 hour winning crew chief

2007 June Srints winner, (GT1, Mohrhauser)

Over 200 race wins and counting.
www.advanced-autosports.com
dave@advanced-autosports.com
608-313-1230

Survive the 25, NASA Thunderhill - Survive the 25, NASA Thunderhill We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Sponsor / Advertiser - Site sponsor / advertiser... support these guys! Donor - Made PayPal donation Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver

#23
Diller

Diller

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 150 posts
  • Location:Nashville
  • Region:South East
  • Car Year:1999
  • Car Number:05

Any reason that the subframe plates had to be sourced from Mazda and these do not?

 

Not that I am complaining because the front braces are extremely well priced but there is some inconsistency.

 

Also, reliability is a performance advantage weather you like it or not, ask any IMSA or endurance team. It does become a slippery slope when the argument for any cheater part becomes "reliability". If it's unclear I do support this modification (even though I just rebuilt a diff without welding in the brace) but think it should be spelled out similar to how the front braces were.


We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver

#24
FTodaro

FTodaro

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,742 posts
  • Location:Columbus Ohio
  • Region:Great Lakes
  • Car Year:2001
  • Car Number:35

Dewey. Normal bump drafting does not break the diffs. This is less likely to happen when you have your foot on the gas more likely when you are off the gas or miss a shift and get nailed hard. In my experience.


  • Sean - MiataCage and Danica Davison like this

Frank
TnT Racing
SCCA Ohio Valley Region
Chairman, SCCA Great Lakes Divisional Series Committee.

Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+ We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Donor - Made PayPal donation

#25
Jim Drago

Jim Drago

    East Street Racing / 2 Time National Champion

  • Administrators
  • 5,408 posts
  • Location:Memphis, Tn
  • Region:Mid South
  • Car Year:2000
  • Car Number:2

For those of you worried about legality, this has been legal for many years. I wrote a letter and requested a definitive answer. That is when the words about trans and diff housings was added to the rule quoted above.

 

Been legal since begining of SM by "industry standard repair"

Specificly made legal by my letter and change in wording many years ago.

Not a performance advantage.

Not a slippery slope to prod rules.

Many of you just did not know about the rule or the problem. 

 

Jim, being a business man, is simply making the part available to those of you who can not weld aluminum. And at a reasonable price. Look up a new one, close to $1000. Even used are in the $300 range.

 

Dave

Dave

I really think we did a disservice when we did this, not sure if you were on SMAC then or not. So it was likely SMAC and me as CRB rep at the time.  We left the rule vague for all the reasons you listed. But IMO, if I was asked to inspect and rule on what I have listed.. I would rule it non compliant.  Many of the housings that I have seen are butchered up nasty looking examples of plating housings that were broken in half. The plating in that example "could" be justified as industry standard repair as plating a broken piece is "normal"  Taking a nice virgin housing and plating it like we did to hopefully guarantee it doesn't fail in hard bump draft or stacking in first few corners...  I would think that is a tortured interpretation.  I feel confident that I could likely win an appeal, but I think it needs to be spelled out to alleviate any concerns. I would hate to have to make up a story(why everything in original post is in quotes) in order to do what makes the most sense. I have no intentions of pulling mine out at this point, I have no intentions of welding it all the way around to "look" more like a repair and  I would quit racing  before I would put one of those frankenstein looking POS repairs in my car.  Hopefully the SMAC will "repair" (pun intended) the rule. However I won't change what I am doing now regardless of the the rule. 

I will take my chances.  :)


East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080

Hoosier Super Tour points Champion - Hoosier Super Tour points Champion ARRC Champion - Won the ARRC Race in a Spec Miata Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata BFG Supertour Winner - Majors Winner - Circuit of the Americas Winner - We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America

#26
Jim Drago

Jim Drago

    East Street Racing / 2 Time National Champion

  • Administrators
  • 5,408 posts
  • Location:Memphis, Tn
  • Region:Mid South
  • Car Year:2000
  • Car Number:2

Any reason that the subframe plates had to be sourced from Mazda and these do not?

 

Not that I am complaining because the front braces are extremely well priced but there is some inconsistency.

 

Also, reliability is a performance advantage weather you like it or not, ask any IMSA or endurance team. It does become a slippery slope when the argument for any cheater part becomes "reliability". If it's unclear I do support this modification (even though I just rebuilt a diff without welding in the brace) but think it should be spelled out similar to how the front braces were.

 

 

Pretty simple.. 

The fear was front pick up points could be moved and hidden under the front subframe braces.. Pretty hard to move anything without changing the diff housing and welding a piece on the inside of the perimeter of the original housing.   

Jim


East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080

Hoosier Super Tour points Champion - Hoosier Super Tour points Champion ARRC Champion - Won the ARRC Race in a Spec Miata Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata BFG Supertour Winner - Majors Winner - Circuit of the Americas Winner - We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America

#27
dickcdawg

dickcdawg

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 25 posts
  • Location:Knoxville, TN
  • Region:ETR
  • Car Year:1992
  • Car Number:39 ITA

Have 1.6 diff housings experienced similar breakage, benefit from same gusseting? 

 

Dick H.

#39 ITA - '92 Miata - SeDiv North



#28
Danica Davison

Danica Davison

    Always the bridesmaid never the bride

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 891 posts
  • Location:Jacksonville Biatch
  • Region:Central Florida
  • Car Year:1999
  • Car Number:10

It would be a weeny protest. 

 

hmmmmmmmmm.  never make another bet with me Jimbo :) 


  • EMatoy likes this

John Davison
Autotechnik Racing / 5x Racing
2016 - Central Florida Region Champion
2017 - The People's Champion
2017 - President of DSFC
#itcouldbeyou

Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata Chatterbox - Blah blah blah... Blah blah blah Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver

#29
Jim Drago

Jim Drago

    East Street Racing / 2 Time National Champion

  • Administrators
  • 5,408 posts
  • Location:Memphis, Tn
  • Region:Mid South
  • Car Year:2000
  • Car Number:2

hmmmmmmmmm.  never make another bet with me Jimbo :)

You want to make another bet this will be addressed and resolved by runoffs ;)


  • Bench Racer likes this

East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080

Hoosier Super Tour points Champion - Hoosier Super Tour points Champion ARRC Champion - Won the ARRC Race in a Spec Miata Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata BFG Supertour Winner - Majors Winner - Circuit of the Americas Winner - We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America

#30
Bench Racer

Bench Racer

    Different strokes for different folks : )

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,620 posts
  • Location:Wauwatosa, WI
  • Region:Milwaukee
  • Car Year:1990
  • Car Number:14

Dewey. Normal bump drafting does not break the diffs. This is less likely to happen when you have your foot on the gas more likely when you are off the gas or miss a shift and get nailed hard. In my experience.

Frankie no matter how the words are packaged, it's an a$$ packing which STARTS the crack or breaks the diff. How many diff's. from street cars/never on a track have you found with hairline cracks or fractures? 

 

The Wheeler's, Drago's and others who view lots of diff's. from never tracked diff's. to race tracked diff's. know the facts.

 

It would appear one fact (Jim's prepped diff. housing) is only the passenger side breaks. Question, why does only the passenger side have OEM notches and or get beefed up? Diff. pinion rotational direction/speed? 


Broken record - You are starting to sound like a broken record. Donor - Made PayPal donation Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver

#31
Caveman-kwebb99

Caveman-kwebb99

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,808 posts
  • Location:World Wide
  • Region:Great lakes
  • Car Year:2000
  • Car Number:99

Had the CaveMan diff. previously in other races/qualifying been involved in bump drafting?

 

I wasnt sure what you were asking till you replied to frank.  my car goes up on a two post rack after every race for nut and bolt and inspection of parts like diff carier subframes etc.  I have never found a crack even a slight one in the diff carier or my subframes other then a cleanly broken diff carrier those two times I mentioned... it actually kind of suprises me on the diff carrier as I have been the recipient of some hard ass bump drafts... Maybe I have just been lucky??? No idea...


K. Webb
Powered by East Street Racing (Best engines in Spec Miata)

Driver coach, Spec Miata Prep shop, Spec Miata Setup

2016 Hard Charger award passing 12 cars runoffs 2016 Mid Ohio

2016 P3 RUNOFFS OVER 40 DIVISION LOL!

2015 First consolation prize Northern Conference Majors Title Pageant
2015 Winner Circus Cat Majors Road America

2015 Winner BlackHawk Majors crash fest

My Signature is still not as long as Danny boy's
 

 

 

Donor - Made PayPal donation Majors Winner - Chatterbox - Blah blah blah... Blah blah blah Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+

#32
Caveman-kwebb99

Caveman-kwebb99

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,808 posts
  • Location:World Wide
  • Region:Great lakes
  • Car Year:2000
  • Car Number:99

You want to make another bet this will be addressed and resolved by runoffs ;)

 

 

If only you had done your damn job! No bets would be neccessary!!!! XOXOXOXOXO


  • Jim Drago, 38bfast and Danica Davison like this

K. Webb
Powered by East Street Racing (Best engines in Spec Miata)

Driver coach, Spec Miata Prep shop, Spec Miata Setup

2016 Hard Charger award passing 12 cars runoffs 2016 Mid Ohio

2016 P3 RUNOFFS OVER 40 DIVISION LOL!

2015 First consolation prize Northern Conference Majors Title Pageant
2015 Winner Circus Cat Majors Road America

2015 Winner BlackHawk Majors crash fest

My Signature is still not as long as Danny boy's
 

 

 

Donor - Made PayPal donation Majors Winner - Chatterbox - Blah blah blah... Blah blah blah Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+

#33
Danica Davison

Danica Davison

    Always the bridesmaid never the bride

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 891 posts
  • Location:Jacksonville Biatch
  • Region:Central Florida
  • Car Year:1999
  • Car Number:10

I wasnt sure what you were asking till you replied to frank.  my car goes up on a two post rack after every race for nut and bolt and inspection of parts like diff carier subframes etc.  I have never found a crack even a slight one in the diff carier or my subframes other then a cleanly broken diff carrier those two times I mentioned... it actually kind of suprises me on the diff carrier as I have been the recipient of some hard ass bump drafts... Maybe I have just been lucky??? No idea...

 

It has actually happened a couple of times within the last two years or so at Daytona. Daytona being probably one of the most bump draft dependent tracks in the country.  You have the guys that get driven away from coming out of either the bus stop or turn 6 and they get sucked back in from a little too far back.  If they don't ease off before hitting bumping in to the car in front, it can break the diff housing.  That's the only track I know of that really has an issue with breaking diff housings because of people not knowing how to bump draft


John Davison
Autotechnik Racing / 5x Racing
2016 - Central Florida Region Champion
2017 - The People's Champion
2017 - President of DSFC
#itcouldbeyou

Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata Chatterbox - Blah blah blah... Blah blah blah Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver

#34
dstevens

dstevens

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,361 posts
  • Location:Vegas
  • Region:LVR
  • Car Year:1990


While we are at it...lets make it ok to keep or remove anything under the dash! We are beyond show room stock...we don't need heater cores or fans or anything related. We need to eliminate the "non performance argument" from peoples minds and just let things that don't matter go!  

 

35863679406_dd5890f8b1.jpg



#35
Jim Drago

Jim Drago

    East Street Racing / 2 Time National Champion

  • Administrators
  • 5,408 posts
  • Location:Memphis, Tn
  • Region:Mid South
  • Car Year:2000
  • Car Number:2

If only you had done your damn job! No bets would be neccessary!!!! XOXOXOXOXO

and we would be missing out on all this fun :)


East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080

Hoosier Super Tour points Champion - Hoosier Super Tour points Champion ARRC Champion - Won the ARRC Race in a Spec Miata Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata BFG Supertour Winner - Majors Winner - Circuit of the Americas Winner - We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America

#36
Caveman-kwebb99

Caveman-kwebb99

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,808 posts
  • Location:World Wide
  • Region:Great lakes
  • Car Year:2000
  • Car Number:99

and we would be missing out on all this fun :)

 

 

this is fun????? ;)  Nobody is even making fun of Danny!


  • Jim Drago, Danny Steyn and Danica Davison like this

K. Webb
Powered by East Street Racing (Best engines in Spec Miata)

Driver coach, Spec Miata Prep shop, Spec Miata Setup

2016 Hard Charger award passing 12 cars runoffs 2016 Mid Ohio

2016 P3 RUNOFFS OVER 40 DIVISION LOL!

2015 First consolation prize Northern Conference Majors Title Pageant
2015 Winner Circus Cat Majors Road America

2015 Winner BlackHawk Majors crash fest

My Signature is still not as long as Danny boy's
 

 

 

Donor - Made PayPal donation Majors Winner - Chatterbox - Blah blah blah... Blah blah blah Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+

#37
Jim Drago

Jim Drago

    East Street Racing / 2 Time National Champion

  • Administrators
  • 5,408 posts
  • Location:Memphis, Tn
  • Region:Mid South
  • Car Year:2000
  • Car Number:2

Here you go..  take a look at 7:25 to 8:00

Thats all it takes

Jim

 

http://www.ustream.t...orded/100564920


East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080

Hoosier Super Tour points Champion - Hoosier Super Tour points Champion ARRC Champion - Won the ARRC Race in a Spec Miata Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata BFG Supertour Winner - Majors Winner - Circuit of the Americas Winner - We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America

#38
Caveman-kwebb99

Caveman-kwebb99

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,808 posts
  • Location:World Wide
  • Region:Great lakes
  • Car Year:2000
  • Car Number:99

Here you go..  take a look at 7:25 to 8:00

Thats all it takes

Jim

 

http://www.ustream.t...orded/100564920

 

Seemed like alot fo brake checking before the broken diff just sayin!   


K. Webb
Powered by East Street Racing (Best engines in Spec Miata)

Driver coach, Spec Miata Prep shop, Spec Miata Setup

2016 Hard Charger award passing 12 cars runoffs 2016 Mid Ohio

2016 P3 RUNOFFS OVER 40 DIVISION LOL!

2015 First consolation prize Northern Conference Majors Title Pageant
2015 Winner Circus Cat Majors Road America

2015 Winner BlackHawk Majors crash fest

My Signature is still not as long as Danny boy's
 

 

 

Donor - Made PayPal donation Majors Winner - Chatterbox - Blah blah blah... Blah blah blah Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+

#39
FTodaro

FTodaro

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,742 posts
  • Location:Columbus Ohio
  • Region:Great Lakes
  • Car Year:2001
  • Car Number:35

Jim when you go in and fix the "Diff Rule" go ahead and get rid of the two gasket requirement on the restrictor plate also, if you want to clean a few things up. :)


Frank
TnT Racing
SCCA Ohio Valley Region
Chairman, SCCA Great Lakes Divisional Series Committee.

Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+ We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Donor - Made PayPal donation

#40
EMatoy

EMatoy

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 53 posts
  • Region:Detroit
  • Car Year:1990
  • Car Number:73

Have 1.6 diff housings experienced similar breakage, benefit from same gusseting?

Dick H.
#39 ITA - '92 Miata - SeDiv North


The 1.6 housings don't have the notch. I don't know of any of them breaking.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users