148 replies to this topic

[Jim Drago]

I'm not sure if anything is set, so we might as well kick around some ideas. If nothing else it could be fun. 

 

my thoughts... after three quailfyings... run a qualifying race for everyone not in the top forty... the top 10 from that race advance to the Runoffs race which has 50 entrants.  That gives you two races with 50 plus cars and we lose one qualifying. 

 

What ideas do you have?

[chris haldeman]

There seems to be some time at the end of Thursday for a qual race. I say allow all 4 qual session then qual race the end of the day Thursday. Top 40 or 50 in qual make the feature and the remainder race it out in the Thursday evening qual race for the final 5-10 spots.
This is the runoffs and should not be compromised because of an all inclusive mentality

[Martinracing98]

2.2. A maximum of 72 cars will be allowed on course at one time. Class Oversubscription will be handled as follows:

• Qualifying
  • Split into two, separate qualifying groups run back-to-back in the schedule OR
  • Place the oversubscribed cars into a qualifying group with another class, run back-to-back in the schedule
  • Qualifying grid will be based on Supplemental Regulations Section 5.7, with session grids posted for each day at Driver Information.
  • Following Wednesday’s qualifying session, drivers outside of the top 60 positions for the week will be gridded in order for a 15- minute timed “Last Chance” race to be run on Thursday after the final qualifying session for the top 60 qualifiers. The top 12 finishers from the “Last Chance” race will advance to the National Championship race, starting in positions 61-72.
• All sessions will be limited to 72 cars. 

[chris haldeman]

We know what has been posted. Most are looking for a better option

[steve]

I suggest the fastest car from each state makes the big race.

[Danica Davison]

Jim, I agree we may have somewhat of an issue here with so many cars registered. But, I am against taking away another session when we already have like one day's worth of track time spread out over 5 days. I agree with Chris' on being too inclusive. However, I think it would look really bad on the SCCA and the Spec Miata class if we told everyone that we can run 72 cars in the race in the beginning of the year ... and then people spend time and money all year long to go to Indy knowing this rule... and then we turn around and say "no no only top 50 cars", I think that would just be a bad PR move for the class. 

 

I don't want to be dealing with all the lap traffic either, but I think it is too late to change this now.  I would say it would have been okay to say that earlier in the year when people didn't dedicate their time and money to go to Indy.  Like, I still think the 115% rule is way too high for Spec Miata but that rule needs to be in place way before people commit their whole year to this. We will all know going into this race that there might be a lot of lap cars, and it very well could impact the race, but we are now all dealt the same card going into it.

 

I would suggest during that week that we have Spec Miata only drivers meetings (more than one) and we educate the slower guys about getting out of the way of the lead lap cars in the race.  Just drill it into everyone's head.

[Danica Davison]

What I think is more of a head scratcher for SCCA to figure out is the SRF/SRF3 qualifying method.  They were going to put the overflow of the SRF3 into the SRF group, but as of right now they have 97 SRF3 and 49 SRF (146 cars).  That is 73 cars per group ...

 

SCCA already made time in their schedule for the SM group being too large ... but I don't think they thought SRF/3 was going to pull in this many entries.  I thought they were making SRF a regional class anyways now? What happened with that?

[Martinracing98]

I thought they were making SRF a regional class anyways now? What happened with that?

I am pretty sure this is the last year of separate classes.

[Ron Alan]

Order of sign up? 73+ wait list...

 

When is the last opportunity to request a refund? For me if I knew I had a chance to be bumped after spending a decent sum of money I would probably wise up and bail before the expense. My guess is the field will be naturally slimmed prior to race week. If 90 cars show up chances of 18 being crashed or blown up is not out of the realm of possibilities? And for sure if you do some sort of qualifying races very good chance only 72 or less will be left to run the big show!

 

72 should run! Hopefully number 72 will be at a pace not to get lapped. But if he and 10 others are not...let the chips fall were they may! Some will say a National Championship should not be decided by cars being lapped. I say this is car racing...strap on your helmet and drive it like you stole it! Any attempt to lecture other adults on what they should or shouldn't do is self serving BS...IMO 

 

That said...if it were me being lapped and I wanted to be courteous...if at all possible I would dive through the hot pits to avoid the top cars... 

[Alberto]

Back in 2011 and 2012 when SFR SCCA had big enough car counts that they ran out of 2 digit car numbers and had 70-80+ cars in attendance with some regularity, they'd run even / odd qualifying events based on car numbers.  I think they shortened to 15 minutes sessions.  Regional races.

[Bench Racer]

It I were there, I'd be lapped. If I were doing the lapping, I'd expect the lapper to follow THE classic line and it's up to me the passer to pass cleanly as the Pro road racers who are always mixed with lappers because of speed differential do. Most of us at SCCA drivers school had the passing/classic line drilled into our beans.

[Danica Davison]

Bench and Ron are right. I was not clear, so let me rephrase. I do not mean for them to "get out of the way" like I said .. but to do their best in getting out of the racing if that makes sense.  Like not driving in deep side by side with leaders, maybe breathing off the throttle to let leaders go by easier on straights, but still maintaining a predictable racing line etc.

[Bench Racer]

 Like not driving in deep side by side with leaders, maybe breathing off the throttle to let leaders go by easier on straights, but still maintaining the classic racing line etc.

[sentercut]

I am curious how many of the 90+ entrants are first timers. I would guess it is close to 30-40%. I am one of them, and cant wait for the spectacle of it all. 

 

I like the idea of top 40-50, and the LCQ race for the remaining 22-32 spots, but if they did it that way I would prefer it being longer than 15 minutes. 20 I would be fine with, but my guess is that the LCQ is going to be chaos, and track position will be huge. I hope i don't have to experience that but either way it is going to be blast, and I will be grinning most of the week, and hopefully weeks after.

 

The cost of it all is daunting, but that is part of the deal spending 10 days racing for our national championship at the most iconic venue in North America. Don't get me wrong, since getting into road racing I have wanted to go to the runoffs, but being at IMP pushed me over the edge to make it happen. I have sold guns, cars, electronics, securities, and have worked especially hard this past year in preparation to be able to go. The qualifying of 3 Majors made it simple, but I also feel like there should have been some minimum of points that had to be achieved in some form or fashion. I also get that this will break many records if not all of them for SCCA Runoffs attendance, which is a great thing for our club. 

[Jim Drago]

Jim, I agree we may have somewhat of an issue here with so many cars registered. But, I am against taking away another session when we already have like one day's worth of track time spread out over 5 days. I agree with Chris' on being too inclusive. However, I think it would look really bad on the SCCA and the Spec Miata class if we told everyone that we can run 72 cars in the race in the beginning of the year ... and then people spend time and money all year long to go to Indy knowing this rule... and then we turn around and say "no no only top 50 cars", I think that would just be a bad PR move for the class. 

 

I don't want to be dealing with all the lap traffic either, but I think it is too late to change this now.  I would say it would have been okay to say that earlier in the year when people didn't dedicate their time and money to go to Indy.  Like, I still think the 115% rule is way too high for Spec Miata but that rule needs to be in place way before people commit their whole year to this. We will all know going into this race that there might be a lot of lap cars, and it very well could impact the race, but we are now all dealt the same card going into it.

 

I would suggest during that week that we have Spec Miata only drivers meetings (more than one) and we educate the slower guys about getting out of the way of the lead lap cars in the race.  Just drill it into everyone's head.

I was considering you as one of the guys we would be lapping

[Caveman-kwebb99]

I was considering you as one of the guys we would be lapping

Jim while you are considering this possibility... Just image the delight for Danny! It will be just as good for him lapping Davison as a title would ever be.

Dannys webmaster will have a new website up before the end of that day, when will Davison keep from being lapped again... Tictoctictoc

[DrDomm]

I considered posting this topic a few days ago, but thought I'd wait.  I think we should listen to what the guys who will qualify outside of the top 40 think.  I'm likely to be one of the guys in the qualifying race, as it currently is in the Supps.  I think the SCCA has to stick with the 72 cars for the race...that's what was posted and how I planned my season.  I like the idea of a race to get the last 12 spots.  That's cool.  I just don't think 15 minutes is fair.  Make it at least 25 minutes...same for SRF3.

 

Also, we stand at 92 cars right now.  Even if that gets up to 100, they all won't show up (I don't even have a drivetrain in my car right now).  Unfortunately, some will have mechanical and contact issues during the week.  Let's say there are 85 cars after Thursday qualifying...awesome!  Let 25 cars have a 25-35 minute race...that will be exciting.  I'd encourage SCCA, Hoosier and Mazda to give contingencies for this race...finishing top 12 in that race will really mean something.

 

After lap 1 of the Championship Race, the leaders are likely to be about 1:30 behind the back of the field (I'm guessing).  I think they'd have to be 4.7 sec quicker per lap to catch traffic (barring the typical off course excursions).  I've looked through the list...I really think there are more than 72 quality drivers there...this is just a great problem to have.

[MPR22]

This won't get me any love but for those of you who are likely to not make the 72 should consider switching your entry to STL. It seems that this is a bucket list track for many and if you are going to the runoffs for the "experience" of the runoffs or Indy then you get the most bang for your buck racing STL.

[Peter Olivola]

That only works if they're qualified in STL.  Not that many opportunities left to do so.  It would be interesting to see where the dual dippers have been gridded in SM.  It would also be interesting to compile the list of SM/STL dual dippers already registered for the Runoffs.

 

This won't get me any love but for those of you who are likely to not make the 72 should consider switching your entry to STL. It seems that this is a bucket list track for many and if you are going to the runoffs for the "experience" of the runoffs or Indy then you get the most bang for your buck racing STL.

[Danica Davison]

That only works if they're qualified in STL.  Not that many opportunities left to do so.  It would be interesting to see where the dual dippers have been gridded in SM.  It would also be interesting to compile the list of SM/STL dual dippers already registered for the Runoffs.

 

All SM drivers currently registered for Runoffs in a second class:

 

Wickline, Andrew …….. B-Spec …….. Mini cooper
Reynolds, Matt …….. E Production …….. Mazda Miata
Campbell, Charlie …….. F Production …….. Mazda Miata
Harding, Dan …….. GT-2 …….. Porsche 996 GT3 Cup
Nufer, Max …….. GT-2 …….. Chevrolet Monte Carlo GTA
Tweedlie, Dave …….. Prototype 2 …….. Radical SR3
Cambern, B Clark …….. STL …….. Mazda Miata
Cheaney, Brian …….. STL …….. Mazda Miata
Elder, Justin …….. STL …….. Mazda Miata
Keeling, William …….. STL …….. Mazda Miata
Leverone, Nick …….. STL …….. Mazda Miata
Mills, Amy …….. STL …….. Mazda Miata
Schubert, Joe …….. STL …….. Mazda Miata
Steyn, Danny …….. STL …….. Mazda MX-5
Gregg, Whitfield …….. Touring 4 …….. Subaru BRZ
Hart, Thomas …….. Touring 4 …….. Mazda MX-5