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VVT revisited

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#1
Sphinx

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Conventional wisdom seems to be that the non-VVT (and less complicated) cars are the way to go, though marginally.  I read some threads with JIm Drago and Danny Steyn basically saying that the two cars are basically the same, with some minor variation.

 

If you are doing a white-board build, would you start with a VVT or a non-VVT car?



#2
Tom Sager

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This should fun...

 

I think it's somewhat track dependent but first off the cars are so close it may not be relevant.   Personally I like the '99/'00 with slightly less weight and slightly better top end.  However for tracks with a lot of bottom of 3rd or bottom of 4th gear corner exits the VVT races well.  In the Northern conference most of the tracks except Road America are of this type. 

 

Anything Pre-'99 has fewer electrical gremlins and that is a plus.  


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#3
Johnny D

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Both Jim and Danny are running VVT's at the Runoffs. (2001~2005 I believe.)

 

https://www.motorspo...9E92F30057DFD76

 

Just sayin

 

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#4
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Indy is a vvt track by far, and this is the only time any of us will race a 99+ Miata there.

Mid Ohio is a toss up I'm between the two cars gingerman, Grattan are vvt tracks, no idea about pittrace, I always take my 99 to ATL, would take my 99 to vir and Watkins Glen, and road America if I was to choose between the two.

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#5
Johnny D

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Remember West Coast are mostly 4 gear top gear twister tracks while back East are more 5 gears horse power track. Not Mid-O though

 

YMMV

 

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#6
Jim Drago

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Conventional wisdom seems to be that the non-VVT (and less complicated) cars are the way to go, though marginally.  I read some threads with JIm Drago and Danny Steyn basically saying that the two cars are basically the same, with some minor variation.

 

If you are doing a white-board build, would you start with a VVT or a non-VVT car?

It is a toss up at most tracks. A few favor the 99 and a few the VVT, but any car can win at any track IMO.  I decided to stay with the VVT.  I think at Indy.. the VVT will be the same or better on 60-75% of the track, the exception being the best passing zone, which is at the end of the front straight. I tested there and don't think the version of your car will win or lose you the race though.  I think it would be hard for a 99 to draft past a good VVT by S/F, but possible.  A 99/00 can easily draft by before the braking zone at turn 1.   


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#7
davew

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June Sprints was Bender (99) Drago (VVT) and Voytek (VVT) all within a car length.

 

I don't think it makes any difference over the length of a race.


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#8
Danica Davison

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Okay, this is a little long winded, but I think it has some good substance.

 

I think it is pretty track dependent for which one is most advantageous, however, I still don't think there is much difference at the pointy end of the field for either car. I am agreeing with Danny and Jim and others on it being pretty equal. I think the biggest advantage of the VVT is that the extra torque makes up for a little mistake you may make in the corner.  So, I think for a guy who is barely keeping up with the front pack, or mid pack guy, the VVT is going to be a much better car for you because you can mask your mistakes a little bit easier.  The guys like Haldeman, Drago, Bolanos, etc ... don't make many mistakes in a race .. so it doesn't really help/hurt them for either car they choose. 

 

I think most of the front guys have just switched to VVT's because others have and they don't want to feel that they are at a disadvantage by running the older car, even though they really aren't. Look, Drago ran his 99 at Homestead and finished 2nd to the Cuban who has 10,000 laps at the track. Then he ran his VVT car at Sebring and finished 1st and 3rd.  Haldeman ran his rental 99 at COTA, where him and Drago in his VVT checked out both races and they split the wins.  Haldeman also ran his 99 at Nola and got a win, and 99 at June Sprints and got 2nd side by side with Drago.

 

I will use the Southeast because I know all of the cars and tracks well for more examples: 

 

Daytona:

You would think this track should be '99 track with the long tri-oval, right?.

2015: '99 domination, but I think this is mainly because Cory Collum and Alex Bolanos run very well together at Daytona and were both in 99's that year. Also, Goring won the Runoffs in a '99, but it rained and we all know how that went.  I think Blake Clements got the only VVT win that year.

 

2016-2017:  7 '99 wins and 5 VVT wins. So, basically even! Also, all of those races were decided within 0.0xx of a second between ALL the years of cars.  Using just my finishes, four of the races that I finished P2-P4 has a COMBINED margin of victory from first to my position of 0.623. Three of those finishes were four wide, or almost 4 wide, in this order (99, VVT, 1.8NA, 99), (VVT, 99, 99, 99), and (VVT, 99, 99, 1.8NA). Out of those finishes, the biggest margin from 1st to 4th was 0.282 seconds.  So, I would say the cars are even at Daytona as well.

 

Sebring:

You would think it would be a VVT track with all of the slower corners, right? Wrong, it has been dead even.

Since November 2015, there has been a dead even split of 99-VVT wins for both Majors and Regionals. I am counting the regionals in this because we have close to 10 majors capable winning drivers/car combinations that race in Florida, especially when OPM comes down too. There have been 11 VVT wins and 11 '99 wins since that time. 

 

Other Tracks:

Roebling majors had Selin Rollan (99) and Danny Steyn (VVT) split wins this year. 

Track record is still held by Buras in his 1.6

 

Road Atlanta:

Michael Carter and Selin won in their 99s, with Danny and Preston finishing right there in the VVTs. The year before, John carter, Drago, and Blake Clements dominated in their VVTs.

 

 

Long story short, I think it helps to have the extra torque of the VVT, but the division of the finishes support the theory that the cars are pretty equal and can both win on any track in any given race.  However, we went with the 99 when we built my car because Autotechnik hadn't built a VVT car yet, so we didn't want to be the test dummy.  But, since the VVT/99 seems to be about even, I would say pick the one that YOU feel is the most advantageous to you and the tracks you race. 


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