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3rd Bosch Wideband failed in a year

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#1
luvin_the_rings

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Had my third innovate Bosch 4.9 sensor go last weekend. Moved the bung before replacing the last one that failed to the specified position in the manual. I was expecting this one to last a bit longer then 4 months.

Do they go bad with overly rich or lean mixtures? We usually stay in the range of 12.0-14.0 during all conditions.

Anybody know where to get them cheaper? Tips for making them last longer b sides the mounting location and angle to keep condensation out?

#2
FTodaro

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Had my third innovate Bosch 4.9 sensor go last weekend. Moved the bung before replacing the last one that failed to the specified position in the manual. I was expecting this one to last a bit longer then 4 months.

Do they go bad with overly rich or lean mixtures? We usually stay in the range of 12.0-14.0 during all conditions.

Anybody know where to get them cheaper? Tips for making them last longer b sides the mounting location and angle to keep condensation out?

did you weld in a half inch bung so the tip is not in the line of fire? you do not need to get the tip in the hot flow, it just as to be able to sniff it, also should be mounted between 10 and 2. I have mine in the tube just past the trans fill hole and have only lost one in 4 years.


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#3
OrangeCrush86

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Is the WB powered on a lot while the car is not running?


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#4
FTodaro

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Is the WB powered on a lot while the car is not running?

It is on any time the power is to the unit is on so when i install them I hook it to switched power so its only on when the ignition is on. If power is on all the time, the sensor is heated and that could explain the problem.


Frank
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#5
BNaumann

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My first one lasted about a year, my second one lasted about a day. Haven't installed the third yet. What is your failure mode? Mine starts reading low (~10s). What do you have driving it? I have an AEM gauge. Only thing I think I do that's bad is maybe key-on engine-off time.

#6
Jeff Wasilko

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I had terrible luck with the Innovates, and switched to the AEM gauges.

 

I have one that uses the 4.2 sensor and it's 3+ years old. My wife's car has a newer AEM that uses the 4.9 sensor and we replaced the sensor after 2 years when it started reading weird.



#7
OrangeCrush86

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It is on any time the power is to the unit is on so when i install them I hook it to switched power so its only on when the ignition is on. If power is on all the time, the sensor is heated and that could explain the problem.

 

Also make sure you are not waiting for the WB to heat up before starting the car. A lot of people see the gauge counting up when they do key on, and they think they have to wait. You should always just start the car immediately.


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#8
callumhay

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my 2 cents from a few experiences. I'd be +1 on the AEM, just seems to be less trouble than the innovate. IIRC you need to air calibrate the innovate with the sensor out of the exhaust...don't think AEM calls for that. First car I had ( a 1.6) came with the Innovate..thing stopped working giving me the flashing 9999 I think, re calibrated, worked for a while then conked out...went ahead and replaced 02 sensor  twice in  a short period of time (6 mo-yr)...talked to a local SM shop who rec AEM. Installed a new AEM and everything worked great. On second car..went with AEM right off the bat...no problems. In hind sight when I was doing the new wiring for the AEM, I think my ground was bad on the innovate..at that point I just went ahead and put the AEM in but I still wonder if the problem was as simple as that (the connection was loose). For sure if you have not done so, check the whole system....not just the O2 sensor part. As has been said, you do not want to power the sensor and not have the car running...so if you are doing a compression test or dumping fuel with the pump, maybe a good idea to disconnect the sensor. A couple of times with the AEM I have left the ignition on and gotten distracted only to come back and and find it on...but have not burned it out. Any way just some thoughts maybe will help you out. In terms of finding them cheaper, I was unable to do that and ended up with Amazon I think. 

 

 

Cal 



#9
Steve Scheifler

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You really should not disconnect the sensor while the car is running. It needs the built-in heater running to avoid polluting the sensor.

So far I hate the 4.9s. They may be better in multiple ways but they are fragile. I think the heater control circuit may be particularly critical and some OEM and aftermarket versions seem to be better than others. I’ve read that Bosch sells a proprietary chip for it but maybe not everyone uses it. Innovate seems to have a lot of problems, but they’ve always had their own approach to wideband controllers so that may be part of it.

Given how few miles we actually put on them I still like a good 4.2. The Zeitronix ZT-3 has been solid for multiple cars and for the dyno, and you can get it cheap with a couple different low-profile gauges. Replacement sensors are cheaper too (if bought elsewhere).
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#10
luvin_the_rings

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OK granted, going forward looking into a 4.3 sensor setup on my next car is a good option. 

I'm gonna stick it out with the 4.9 and try to limit the heat.  

 

I'll check the wiring tonight. 

 

I have it oriented at 3 o clock, 1/2 tall bung, but the sensor is right in the flow.  

Has anybody tried this cooling spacer?  lol

 

https://www.amazon.c...ZFF343Z32H0EA2M

 

don't mind welding a new bung either. 



#11
JNJ

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To add to what Steve said, the warm up program is a guarded secret by Bosch and it is what determines the life of the sensor.  Remember the sensor has to make it 7 years or 70,000 miles in an OE application. The sensor is that same one for all applications ( 4.9 or 4.2) but the harness and connectors are different.  I work for an OE, we use Bosch on some applications for fuel management, if you heat it too quick you will have problems, heat it too slow you will have problems.  An OE application has many conditions known including key on, engine off.  But it is watching, ambient temp, engine temp, engine rpm, etc...  Your aftermarket unit only knows key on.  Not to mention the program is likely their best guess.  While I haven't used the AEM, the experience here suggest that you should consider it.  I have an MXL and I have only had one failure.  Note that the MXL has an OB2 connection and has a better warm up program.






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