18 replies to this topic

[Keith Andrews]

This is from the first SARRC race of the 2012 season at VIR.

[Glenn]

I got SCREWED by the same incidint at Drivers School. Double yellow all the way around the course, start finish waving checker NO yellow. RACE to finish passed 2 cars and got REAMED out by officials. Lesson, Im racing whenever I see the double yellow gone let the stewards figure it out later.

[Keith Andrews]

Agreed. I was thinking there has to be someone piled up right around the last corner. Wrong!

[Jim Creighton]

Ok, I'll bite. Where exactly did you get "screwed"?

The video starts with the car in front of you several 100 yards in front of you and the car behind right in your mirror. The video ends with the car in front of several 100 yards in front of you and the car behind you still in your mirror.

It appears to me you ended up just where you were when the double yellow came out. Granted, the car in front of you took off before you did but he was already well in front of you before the yellow.

Enlighten me!

[Glenn]

JIm since when does the track go green after a double yellow without a "green flag" and a pace car?

[Keith Andrews]

Ok, I'll bite. Where exactly did you get "screwed"?

The video starts with the car in front of you several 100 yards in front of you and the car behind right in your mirror. The video ends with the car in front of several 100 yards in front of you and the car behind you still in your mirror.

It appears to me you ended up just where you were when the double yellow came out. Granted, the car in front of you took off before you did but he was already well in front of you before the yellow.

Enlighten me!

Jim,

I was upset at myself for letting the leader get away. We were running similar lap times the video starts as I'm starting to track him down. When he got away I lost the draft, my fault. In the end your right I started 4th and finished there, but there was lots of racing in-between.

[CruzanTom]

Keith,

Good lesson for the rest of us to remember. There is not always a pace car when there is a double yellow.

From the Portable Driver's Handbook:


"If there is a full course yellow (FCY), close up with the car in front of you. . . .

If there is no safety car, the lead car will assume the role of the safety car, and control the field. It should proceed at pace car speed, not near-race speed. . . .

At the end of the FCY period, the safety car will shut off its lights and enter the pits. The field will continue in single file until the starter drops the double yellow (and all corner stations do so at the same moment). Racing resumes all around the track as soon as the double yellow is dropped."

By the way, I was part of the incident in Turn 1. Alan was spun by another car in front of me and I could not avoid him. Both of us were knocked out of the race and the other car (the cause of the spin) continued.

Tom

[Glenn]

Keith,

Good lesson for the rest of us to remember. There is not always a pace car when there is a double yellow.

From the Portable Driver's Handbook:


"If there is a full course yellow (FCY), close up with the car in front of you. . . .

If there is no safety car, the lead car will assume the role of the safety car, and control the field. It should proceed at pace car speed, not near-race speed. . . .

At the end of the FCY period, the safety car will shut off its lights and enter the pits. The field will continue in single file until the starter drops the double yellow (and all corner stations do so at the same moment). Racing resumes all around the track as soon as the double yellow is dropped."

By the way, I was part of the incident in Turn 1. Alan was spun by another car in front of me and I could not avoid him. Both of us were knocked out of the race and the other car (the cause of the spin) continued.

Tom

From GCR 6.6.2, :

The safety car will maintain the established pace, extinguish the lights,

and exit the course prior to a restart. Drivers must maintain the safety

car’s pace and not improve their positions or begin racing until the green

flag has been displayed to restart the race.

If there is no safety car, the race leader will perform its functions.

clearly a green flag was required to restart the race IMHO

[Keith Andrews]

Tom - I'm guessing there were probably guys totally caught out still at or approaching Roller Coaster.

Glenn - That is what I was expecting too, either way I'm guessing the leader got a radio call the double yellow is down so he took off. My Crew Chief (my wife) didn't make that call. I know better than to fall behind like I did. That was a bad move on my part.

[CruzanTom]

Keith,

Clearly it was tough on you and, yes, the leader got a call on the radio that the yellows had dropped so he took off.

I was taught in Driver's School in Savannah that the Double Yellow flags drop at the same time the Green flag is waved so if you are not on the front straight, you should watch the double yellows. The green flag can wave (and yellows drop) anytime, not just when the lead cars approach the start/finish line. Anytime the yellows drop, anywhere on the track, racing begins. At Bondurant School in Phoenix, they made us practice restarts and gave us this scenario one time.

I know you haven't started a race in the back of the pack in a while but this is the situation the mid- and back-packers have every race. They (we) cannot see the green and must watch the car in front of them, the corner worker flags or have someone on the radio holler "Green!" so they know when the race begins. If you look at the "Bat Car repair" thread you can see what happens when some get the "Green!" call but some in front of them do not.

I could not see if a green was shown but it is possible it waved and then they waved the white flag.

Anyway, I am sorry about what happened to you. You ran a good race and were fast all weekend.

Tom

[Panic Motorsports]

Hey Keith

In order of occurance, I got the radio call they were going back to green about "bottom" of roller coaster, looked at the corner station at hog pen (which was no longer double yellow, but was white) and laid the hammer in. You'd stated the corner station was double yellow (on the video text). I have to think it was literally a split second between our views of the corner station and it's flag condition. Coming down roller coaster, I was fully expecting to see the pace car since JB told me there was track blockage at T1. I was REALLY suprised they turned us loose with EV's right on the edge of T1, but that would explain the white flags. Like we talked about after the race, I think like I made the best possible move, and unfortunetly, you made the worst. If anybody can explain to me I did something wrong, or more importantly, unsafe, I'd be all ears. Last thing in the world I want to do it put the workers at risk, and was checking up early inT1 for several laps after until they moved the EV's. I haven't looked at my video coming to start, but I think I was even lifting a bit, unsure they were going to throw a green.

[Scott Malbon]

I was mid-pack and also thought it was confusing. Yellow, even double yellow, doesn't mean you don't race, you just don't pass. The car in front of me was going race pace so at least I wasn't stuck. I thought the rescue vehicles and workers in turn 1 were vulnerable even with the yellow flag, given the speeds we were going. Pace car for a few laps would have kept the race clock ticking and given the EVs time to do their work safely. But I didn't know what else was going on.

Scott

[Blake Thompson]

He played you like a fiddle That's what it takes to stay in front

[Keith Andrews]

Hey Keith

In order of occurance, I got the radio call they were going back to green about "bottom" of roller coaster, looked at the corner station at hog pen (which was no longer double yellow, but was white) and laid the hammer in. You'd stated the corner station was double yellow (on the video text). I have to think it was literally a split second between our views of the corner station and it's flag condition. Coming down roller coaster, I was fully expecting to see the pace car since JB told me there was track blockage at T1. I was REALLY suprised they turned us loose with EV's right on the edge of T1, but that would explain the white flags. Like we talked about after the race, I think like I made the best possible move, and unfortunetly, you made the worst. If anybody can explain to me I did something wrong, or more importantly, unsafe, I'd be all ears. Last thing in the world I want to do it put the workers at risk, and was checking up early inT1 for several laps after until they moved the EV's. I haven't looked at my video coming to start, but I think I was even lifting a bit, unsure they were going to throw a green.

This was not something you did, it was me not paying attention. My problem, I'll give you a call. I was the issue, sorry if it came across any differently.

[Keith Andrews]

Hey Scott,

It was one of those deals, where instead of it taking longer to clean up it took a less time. When was the last time you did 3/4 of a lap under double yellow? We should be happy for that. I just got caught out, as did others. We'll get'em next time.

Good seeing you, it was an incredible weekend.

[Andrew Charbonneau]

Jim,

I was upset at myself for letting the leader get away. We were running similar lap times the video starts as I'm starting to track him down. When he got away I lost the draft, my fault. In the end your right I started 4th and finished there, but there was lots of racing in-between.

Sorry kieth you made a rookie mistake you are supposed to keep up with leader not hold the hole frikin feild retard wave to your wife and girlfreind next time lol

[Andrew Charbonneau]

Ok, I'll bite. Where exactly did you get "screwed"?

The video starts with the car in front of you several 100 yards in front of you and the car behind right in your mirror. The video ends with the car in front of several 100 yards in front of you and the car behind you still in your mirror.

It appears to me you ended up just where you were when the double yellow came out. Granted, the car in front of you took off before you did but he was already well in front of you before the yellow.

Enlighten me! plus 1and a half

[Keith Andrews]

Sorry kieth you made a rookie mistake you are supposed to keep up with leader not hold the hole frikin feild retard wave to your wife and girlfreind next time lol

Absolutely.....I fkd the foks behind me. Oh well still learnin but having a great time doing it. Frikin 53 yr old rookie deeek mistake. Yea sure glad I slowed down for the last cornr workr...

[Panic Motorsports]

Dang, you're fast enough I'd forgotten you are a rookie until Dan reminded me yesterday! LOL!