31 replies to this topic

[DCP]

I need to buy a new harness. Car currently has expired pull down style on a Sparco Evo seat. I have not driven the car yet, but the pull down style seems difficult to use. What do you recommend?

Also - any recommendations on which brand and model to buy would be welcome.

[Mitch Reading]

Pull up on the lap belts, pull down on the shoulders... just my preference.

[davew]

I have 2 recommendations at opposite end of the harness spectrum

Low cost $130 retail. Simpson FX belts. Good quality, made in USA. Latch and link style. What I like about these belts is that the buckle and adjuster are one piece. That means the adjuster is more in front of your belly instead of being over by your hips. Makes adjusting lap belts much easier. Only available as a 3inch lap, 3 inch shoulder, 5 point system. Red, Blue or Black webbing. SFI rated

High cost, $460 retail. SafeCraft belts. BY FAR the best belts I have ever used. Better than Sparco, Willans, Pyrotec etc. Prefered by many Grand-Am/ALMS teams. These are the only cam lock style belt I have found with a buckle/latch one piece adjuster. Best hardware I have ever used. Best adjuster I have ever used. Made just outside of Chicago on a "as ordered basis". Usually only a 2 week lag time. 2 or 3 inch lap, 2 or 3 inch shoulder, 6 point only. several optional buckle designs, pull tabs etc.They are currently black only but are coming out with colors soon. SFI rated, but they offer a free reweb service. Company is owned by Charles Espenlaub.

I currently have no belts in stock of either brand. I always buy belts after the first of the year. SCCA rules give you 2 years plus the remainder of the calendar year. So belts dated December 2012 would expire December 31, 2014. Wait for belts dated January 2013 and they expire December 31, 2015. A full extra year!!!!!

There are lots of brands out there. Everybody has a personal preference. I have given my preferences above. I have reasons for not buying certain brands, that I have chosen not to say. These 2 choices are the only ones I would work from.

Dave

[pitbull113]

G-Force camlocks pull down 5 point $150 ish and they're FIA good for 5 yrs/ thread

[Todd Lamb]

Yep the SafeCraft belts are the best I've ever used for a multi-driver situation (enduros)....for SM where it's one driver and usually "set it and forget it" you can get away with something less expensive, unless you are sharing the car with someone.

[davew]

Since you brought up the g-force belts, look at the manufacturers tag for country of origin. If they can't make dog food or tooth paste, I will not trust them to make my safety equipment.

We have had 2 cars in the last 2 years hit concrete walls at over 100mph. Both had safecraft belts. In both cases the webbing was fine, but the hardware had twisted. Shows the strength of their product.

Dave

[Armando Ramirez]

How about the Schroth Enduro belt?

We need to replace our belts for 2013, and we had looked at SafeCraft belts, however, how-to-purchase did not seem the easiest.

My son and I do share the car for enduros, about 5 per year and either one of these belts would seem to fit the need, with the Schroth Enduro more easily available i.e. thru SafeRacer.

Since you brought up the g-force belts, look at the manufacturers tag for country of origin. If they can't make dog food or tooth paste, I will not trust them to make my safety equipment.

We have had 2 cars in the last 2 years hit concrete walls at over 100mph. Both had safecraft belts. In both cases the webbing was fine, but the hardware had twisted. Shows the strength of their product.

Dave

[robertcope]

Since you brought up the g-force belts, look at the manufacturers tag for country of origin. If they can't make dog food or tooth paste, I will not trust them to make my safety equipment.

Hmm, I have no first hand impact experience (thankfully!), but I guess my thinking on the G-Force belts is that they're so popular they must be involved in their fair share of impacts, and if they had real issues we'd know about them. They're certified... right?

Of course, I really have no idea what the actual breakdown of harness manufacturers is in terms of install base.

Currently shopping for new harnesses, torn between another set of G-Force or some "nice" ones.

robert

[Keith Novak]

I have the G-Force. This will be my last year using them. I don't like their lap belts. The pull down (outward towards the seat) makes them difficult to adjust while seated. You have to adjust before clipping in. I can adjust the shoulder belts just fine. I use a Defnder HNR though which fits 3" belts well. The HANS doesn't fit 3" belts as well. Early next year I'll be buying one of the "nicer" belts.

[davew]

<< We need to replace our belts for 2013, and we had looked at SafeCraft belts, however, how-to-purchase did not seem the easiest. >>

I have what I consider the "recipe" for a Spec Miata. As soon as I can get 2013 dated belts, I will be adding SafeCraft to my website. Probably around December 1st

Remember belts purchased today, will be dated for 2012 and will cost you a year of use, per SCCA.

A little background on belt certifications. FIA and SFI charge for their certification services. Each belt is not tested. The manufacturer submits a style of belts for testing. If they pass the test, they are certified. Random tests can be done over the course of the certification. Every belt design is certified seperately. 5 point is different from 6 point. Latch and link is different from cam lock. 2 or 3 inche belts are different. Pull up is different than pull down. Do the math, it really adds up. The cost per style is $10,000. As I was told a few years ago. That math really add$ up. That is why G-force only has the one style of FIA belts. While their entire line is SFI certified.

After your item is certified, you buy the labels directly from SFI and sew them on. My understanding is that this is what caused Impact to have a problem. They where outsourcing the labels only. Does this insure that every belt would pass the test. NO. You are betting on the integrity of the manufacturer to sell the product you are expecting. I like Simpson and SafeCraft as they are both Made In The USA

Dave

[Johnny D]

Both had safecraft belts. In both cases the webbing was fine, but the hardware had twisted. Shows the strength of their product.

Dave

Why is the twisted hardware good??
J~

[George Munson]

I have used the Schroth Enduro Belts for over a year and other than the Safecraft Belts I wouldn't use anything else. They are extremely comfortable and easy to adjust. I do DE's as well as race so getting in and out a car quickly is important.

[ChrisA]

I've had the Schroth Profi III 6-point previously and just installed a new set of Profi II-Hans 6-point belts. I like the 2" lap belts, able to get them snugged up well. I got mine through HMS Motorsports. They are pretty much able to set them up with whatever fastener/belt attachment/adjustment you want and turn the order around quickly (like in a couple days).

[Brandon]

Why is the twisted hardware good??
J~

I believe Dave W. was referring to the strength of the webbing vs. other brands. In the instance he's noting the webbing didn't stretch/become altered due to the crashes effects but in fact the metal hardware is what ended up "failing".

[davew]

I believe Dave W. was referring to the strength of the webbing vs. other brands. In the instance he's noting the webbing didn't stretch/become altered due to the crashes effects but in fact the metal hardware is what ended up "failing".

Twisted hardware shows the amount of force developed in the incedent. The fact that the hardware bent before the webbing failed shows the strength of the webbing.

Both incedents where 100+mph into unprotected concrete walls, with no time for braking. Walls very close to track surface. Going into turn 10 at Road Atlanta and into turn 5 at Road America. Fortunately all the safety equipment worked.

Dave

[Todd Lamb]

ANY of the webbing from belts on the market will be just fine in an impact....I've done a TON of sled testing with OE seatbelts (much thinner 3-pt) and I've never seen webbing fail unless it was cut by a d-ring or buckle. Be less concerned about the webbing, and more concerned about 2" vs 3" for HANS and comfort, adjustability, and cost.

On a side note, the webbing is designed to stretch in a crash, reducing the max g load on the driver.

[FTodaro]

I've had the Schroth Profi III 6-point previously and just installed a new set of Profi II-Hans 6-point belts. I like the 2" lap belts, able to get them snugged up well. I got mine through HMS Motorsports. They are pretty much able to set them up with whatever fastener/belt attachment/adjustment you want and turn the order around quickly (like in a couple days).

I have had the same belt, bought from the same place for the last 5 years, they are out of date at the end of this year. going back to the same belt and cam lock style. like them allot.

[Anthony Ralston]

Since you brought up the g-force belts, look at the manufacturers tag for country of origin. If they can't make dog food or tooth paste, I will not trust them to make my safety equipment.

We have had 2 cars in the last 2 years hit concrete walls at over 100mph. Both had safecraft belts. In both cases the webbing was fine, but the hardware had twisted. Shows the strength of their product.

Dave

That's great to hear as I just picked up a set of these. (got a great deal, and shipped immediately)

<< We need to replace our belts for 2013, and we had looked at SafeCraft belts, however, how-to-purchase did not seem the easiest. >>

Dave

I had to call to order as their website is under construction. Charles was excellent to work with and the belt quality is incredible. Much better than my old Schroth belt from my track car.

Although I have a question on the sub belt, where did you mount yours to?

[Steve D]

+1 on SafeCraft belts. It's pretty amazing how much better they are than Schroth, GForce and others I've owned.

[svvs]

I'm with you guys on Safecraft belts........mine are the best set of belts I've ever used. I've got the 2" lap belts, pull down. never a problem.