20 replies to this topic

[Duncan]

I wanted to share a story about a  recent purchase of a MOMO seat from Saferacer to get some opinions.

 

Two weeks ago, I ordered a MOMO Lesmo seat from Saferacer.com to replace an expired Momo Daytona seat.  I'd been very happy with the fit of the Daytona in the car and since it wasn't a new build, I wanted to stay with a similar seat to ensure it would fit in the car without modification.  None of the local shops near me stock MOMO.

 

I received the seat two days ago.  When I opened the box, I checked the date of manufacture, and was suprised to see it was January 2013.
I understand that MOMO USA has to carry some inventory to ensure that products make it to US customers in a timely manner, but this is almost 20 percent of the time I can use this seat without a backbrace in NASA gone, before it's ever installed in a car.  In previous seat purchases, I've received seats that were 4-6 months from the date of manufacture, which seems more reasonable.

I called Saferacer, and they said that MOMO USA will only talk to them via email.  They sent an email on my behalf, and they received a reply today.
1.  MOMO USA says this is the latest date available in US inventory.

2.  They suggested that if I were to contact MOMO HQ myself I might be able to get a $25 dollar gift certificate, good for future MOMO gear purchases.  This is less than 3% of the seat cost, so that doesn't seem like much of concession on their part.

 

I was wondering if any others have experiences/thoughts they'd like to share.  Just feeling a little frustrated right now.

 

thanks,

Duncan

[FTodaro]

Years ago when i bought my sparco seat it was a few years old at the point the seat was shipped to me, that is the risk of buying from vendor. I think they are just clearing old inventory. I  do not know why when it comes to seats or any other safety gear for that matter that they cannot stamp the tag at the time of sale vs. time of MFG as its obviously not being used till sold.

 

It was not long before i had to put a brace on the seat, which will allow you to use it beyond the expiration date.

 

I recently bought a new set of harnesses and they were assembled and tagged at the time of my order.

[Armando Ramirez]

Agree with you, do the same as with the batteries.

[wheel]

In SCCA the FIA seat does not expire and does not require a back brace and it does not need to be replaced, unless damaged.

 

wheel

[svvs]

In SCCA the FIA seat does not expire and does not require a back brace and it does not need to be replaced, unless damaged.

 

wheel

True, but NASA still expires FIA seats.  Tough for me because I only run a few NASA races a year, but I really like the guys here in NASA NE.

[Glenn Davis]

True, but NASA still expires FIA seats.  Tough for me because I only run a few NASA races a year, but I really like the guys here in NASA NE.

It would be interesting to hear the science behind NASA's argument that an out of date braced composite seat that was never meant to be braced is better than the out of date composite seat.  I'm guessing that I'll be waiting a long time for the science...

[Johnny D]

It would be interesting to hear the science behind NASA's argument that an out of date braced composite seat that was never meant to be braced is better than the out of date composite seat.  I'm guessing that I'll be waiting a long time for the science...

There's a thread, maybe I'll find it. But the composite doesn't expire. Lawyers reviewed it and it stands, but the sediment is everything ages and for you own safety you should replace it at some point, but there's no rule.

I have my 09 racetech seat but I assume I'll pass tech this year. (NASA) I'll post if I don't.
J~

[mjw]

There's a thread, maybe I'll find it. But the composite doesn't expire. Lawyers reviewed it and it stands, but the sediment is everything ages and for you own safety you should replace it at some point, but there's no rule.

I have my 09 racetech seat but I assume I'll pass tech this year. (NASA) I'll post if I don't.
J~

See page 6 of the FIA spec.

 

http://www.fia.com/s...tion_seat_0.pdf

 

7. Seat life:
The usable life of an FIA homologated seat will
be 5 years from the date of year of manufacture
indicated on the seat label. For example, a
seat manufactured on 1 January 2014 will be
“Not valid after 2019”; likewise, a seat
manufactured on 31 December 2014 will be
“Not valid after 2019”.

[ChrisA]

If there is no difference from Jan-Dec in the life dating, then why the heIl include the month on the homologation label? 

[RussMcB]

In SCCA the FIA seat does not expire and does not require a back brace and it does not need to be replaced, unless damaged.

 

wheel

I'm thankful for this.  Will probably prevent me from running any NASA races.

[Duncan]

See page 6 of the FIA spec.
 
http://www.fia.com/s...tion_seat_0.pdf
 
7. Seat life:
The usable life of an FIA homologated seat will
be 5 years from the date of year of manufacture
indicated on the seat label. For example, a
seat manufactured on 1 January 2014 will be
“Not valid after 2019”; likewise, a seat
manufactured on 31 December 2014 will be
“Not valid after 2019”.

See page 6 of the FIA spec.
 
http://www.fia.com/s...tion_seat_0.pdf
 
7. Seat life:
The usable life of an FIA homologated seat will
be 5 years from the date of year of manufacture
indicated on the seat label. For example, a
seat manufactured on 1 January 2014 will be
“Not valid after 2019”; likewise, a seat
manufactured on 31 December 2014 will be
“Not valid after 2019”.

That's interesting. I'd never heard the spec was until the end of the calendar year. NASA CCR simply says replace after 5 years old. Anybody has any experience with how NASA is enforcing this?

[Johnny D]

I'm going to get my Annual at TC Design, I figured I get caught there, if it was an issue.
Mines 09 but Sept, so...

I guess I could call Tony.
J~

[ChrisA]

If there is no difference from Jan-Dec in the life dating, then why the heIl include the month on the homologation label? 

Just read the FIA rules. They've changed them eliminating the Month and only using Yr now.  

[Johnny D]

ChrisA, This isn't your 1st time in a thread on this issue.

I totally don't want to misinform and please everyone check the rules and tech for SCCA and NASA and correct me, 

Everyone is free to be as safe as they want to.

Your safety is up to you above the rules,

I haven't taken the time to post the SCCA verbage,  but...

When Wheel posts #31~37 Page 2, in the thread I just posted that you are in, isn't that a good indication ??

 

http://mazdaracers.c...olutions/page-2

 

Also NASA in the Club Code and regulations.

http://www.nasaprora...m/rules/ccr.pdf

 

11.4.12 Seats

All seats must be securely fastened to the structure of the car such that they are strong enough to withstand a

major impact. If replaced, the replacement seat should be installed according to the manufacturer’s

instructions. Expired FIA seats may be used in HPDE without a seat back brace if one was not required

originally.

If stock seats are to be used with a roll bar/cage, care should be taken to prevent the seat from submarining

under the roll bar. Care should also be taken to prevent the occupant from hitting his/her head on the roll

bar/cage.

Passenger seats must meet the same minimum requirements, per the CCR, as the driver seat, if used by

passengers. Note- The passenger seat does not have to match the driver’s seat.

 

I hate to post misinformation. If I'm wrong fine, but I'd like to confirm before buying a seat if i'm comfortable with my current safety in my seat.

J~

[fotostars]

I talked to Joe @ TC Design last week about this. My seat is 04/09. He indicated he would give me a Tech for NASA 2014 with a note in the log book that the seat expires in April. The text is interesting in the NASA CCR as it seems to imply that it's according to what the FIA considers expired. Which in my case would be the end of 2014. But then in the seat back support section 15.6.21 it clearly calls 5 years old for the 8855-1999 spec'ed seats.

 

Can anybody who was in this situation last year with NASA chimed in? I'm personally OK keeping mine for another year if the rule allows it.

[ChrisA]

Johnny D, I'm okay on my seat now. Replaced my aging seat with a Racetech which includes seat back bracing in its' design. So old SCCA or current NASA rules don't worry me. I do however, think things like seats, belts & nets should be dated at time of purchase from an authorized dealer, not manufacture. Would be better for the end user as well as the dealer. The change in the FIA rule removing month from the expiration date, can effectively screw many out of a years worth of use (For those series under FIA rule). Manufactures do not build each seat/line continually through out the year. And since most are not made in the US, importing also plays into availability.

[mjw]

For NASA, 11.4.12 is for HPDE only.

 

Here is the section for racing that is important.

 

15.6.21 Seat Back Support
A seatback support must be made to hold the seat from going back in the event of a crash. A plate should be
used to distribute the load. No bolts, corners, or sharp objects should be placed in such a manner that could
lead to a possible puncture of the driver in a high impact crash. Seat back support need not be attached to the
seat itself. Proper design and installation is crucial to safety and it is recommended that the driver employ the
services of a professional race car builder for this, as well as all other vehicle safety items. An exception may
be made for those seats homologated to, and mounted in accordance with, FIA 8855-1999 or 8862-2009
standards. Those seats that qualify for the aforementioned exception must conform to the entire FIA 8855-1999
or 8862-2009 set of regulations, as applicable. This includes a mandatory seat replacement, or use of a seat
back brace, for any seat more than five (5) years old (8855-1999) or more than ten (10) years old (8862-2009).
Please reference the FIA regulations. http://www.fia.com/....ocated as shown
below.

[davew]

As a dealer for many different seat and seat belt manufacturers, I do not want the responsibility of date stamping belts or seats. 

 

I stock small quantitys of belts to make sure I get current dating.

 

Dave

[svvs]

Something else to keep in mind I guess is that most fiberglass seats are imported.....takes time to make enough to fill a container and then ship it to the US.

 

Lots of harnesses made here in the US...safecraft being my choice but they are SFI not FIA....though they do reweb the belts for free.

 

-Vick

[Johnny D]

Thanks guys

 

So based on mjw FIA seat life definition, TC shouldn't even be doing months and I'm good until end of this year ?? 09~14

 

J~