15 replies to this topic

[Danny Steyn]

For those of you that want to watch the fun race between myself and Todd Lamb, or learn the rain line at Road America, here is my video from the 60th running of the June Sprints at Road America. Enjoy

 

[Craig Berry]

Awesome stuff Danny and Todd!!! I dont think I would have anything for you 2, would have loved to just had some kind of oportunity, but the deciscions we make pre race can be half or more of the battle. In hindsight, Danny, I want to give you props for testing both tires in the wet even though the forcast at that time showed a very slim chance of any rain. You put in the work and it paid off. Great job.

[Jim Drago]

I will watch when I have time tonight. I watched the first lap. I second what Craig said, you guys were prepared and it showed. Unfortunately for the rest of us, that race was a two car race from the braking point at turn one, lap one

Jim

[Bench Racer]

At the track, it was interesting/fun to see fromT5 who would lead at T13. Will watch later.

[Blake Thompson]

I like a race where the steering wheel is in my hand more frequently during the day than this guy:

 

[Danny Steyn]

Thanks for the kind words Jim and Craig - yes I tried both sets of tires - worn rains in the wet test day session and sticker slicks in the wet/damp practice session the following day. I was able to run identical times to the 1/10th on both tires, but the braking zones were more predictable with the rains. IN fact I flat spotted my sticker slicks so had to back up the braking points. The line was similar with both tires, but in examining the data, the braking-zone-to-apex was better with rains, and the corner-off was better with slicks. But we opted for rains due to ensuring track position. When it started to rain, I though that I might be at a disadvantage if you three showed up on sticker H2O's but when you showed up with slicks I knew T1 would be ours (Lamb and mine). 

 

I think Lamb had two session H2O's, mine were 6 or 7 session H2O's so about 50% tread, and it gave me the advantage on corner-off.

 

As I always say, never miss a rain session, you never know when its gonna rain on race day. I have put in around 19 wet practice, qualifying and test sessions at Road America with only two rain races, but every session provides additional data and muscle memory, so the approach seems to pay off.

[Jim Drago]

As I always say, never miss a rain session, you never know when its gonna rain on race day. I have put in around 19 wet practice, qualifying and test sessions at Road America with only two rain races, but every session provides additional data and muscle memory, so the approach seems to pay off.

While I will probably regret it, I have to agree We have a very expensive wet tire. So I find myself "saving" my sticker rains for a "rainy day". I used old rains at Hallett and they were not much better than dries and a far cry from what they were as stickers.
From this past sprints forward, regardless of how many sets of rains I ruin, if it rains I am going out. Saving the rains proved to be penny wise and dollar foolish. I was/am confident in my rain driving especially at RA. But not going out is the same or worse as spotting top guys the test day and just showing up to qualify. I drove pretty well with the dries, nothing I did on the dries would have kept me in that race.. but ultimately I bet I wasted 10-15 seconds in that race that I would not have had I gone out in the two wet sessions.

Side note: that will be the easiest that track will ever be in the rain as the patches made every corner a rain line. next year I imagine we will be back to more traditional "rain " lines
Congrats again!

[Blake Thompson]

 Saving the rains is penny wise and dollar foolish. 

 

to say I am low budget is laughable at best but rains are already sunk cost so there's no reason letting them collect dust.

[Jim Drago]

to say I am low budget is laughable at best but rains are already sunk cost so there's no reason letting them collect dust.

The reason is that if you are going to 'win' and it rains and you are on 2-3 session rains VS a guy with sticker rains.. You will be in trouble most times to the tune of a second a lap or so. At least that is my findings and "reasoning" for saving. Oh well, no more.

[Danny Steyn]

Side note: that will be the easiest that track will ever be in the rain as the patches made every corner a rain line. next year I imagine we will be back to more traditional "rain " lines
 

 

Thanks JIm, and wrt the above, every corner that had been patched, with the exception of Canada corner, was faster on the dry line. Every corner that had not been patched were mostly rim shots, but not all, and if very much depended on how much water was on the track. And it took both testing sessions, running completely different lines in back to back laps, analyzing the data, to find out where the time was to be found on each line. 

[Danny Steyn]

to say I am low budget is laughable at best but rains are already sunk cost so there's no reason letting them collect dust.

 

Blake - Jim is spot on. The Hoosier H2O's are the most expensive tire that Spec Miata has ever used. When it is raining, a sticker rain tire is many seconds a lap faster than a 1HC H20, and evey session thereafter makes it slower in rain. So our rain tires have one hero rain session in them and every session thereafter relegates them to test day tires, or to use as intermediate rain tires, which is what I mounted for the June Sprints.

 

For our race we all knew it wasn't going to be really wet and raining, more like drizzling and we knew it would dry out, and then the full tread sticker H2O rains would become a liability. I believe my rains were more worn than Todds which gave me the advantage of less tread as the track dried out. Less tread means less squirm, less heat and better drive off the corners.

 

• So the upside of Hoosier H2O's is that they make everyone a great rain driver.
• But the downside of Hoosier H2O's is that you really need to mount a set of stickers on a set of wheels that you save for the rain race, and you need to have a worn set mounted on another set of wheels to use for test, practice and qualifying sessions, and perhaps to use in the race, as long as they are nor completely worn out, if it looks as if the track might dry out during the race. 

[Blake Thompson]

oppo through 5 & 6.  CLANG CLANG

[Todd Lamb]

Fun to watch from the other perspective. Interesting how all the big slides don't look that big on camera  - they just feel big in the car. I can tell you I was all over the wheel in the carousel hanging on and the speed differential shows. T3 and T6 were especially bad for me as well. But T5, T7, and kink were really good. Probably a little to do with the way I set my car up for the dry vs. Danny, and partly due to the tires (new vs. old rains).

[Blake Thompson]

Fun to watch from the other perspective. Interesting how all the big slides don't look that big on camera  - they just feel big in the car. I can tell you I was all over the wheel in the carousel hanging on and the speed differential shows. T3 and T6 were especially bad for me as well. But T5, T7, and kink were really good. Probably a little to do with the way I set my car up for the dry vs. Danny, and partly due to the tires (new vs. old rains).

 

There's a shot of you chasing Danny through the carosel where you're hanging it all the way through the first 2/3 of the arc.  Clip that out and staple it to the forehead of all these stanced out weirdos.

 

Considering that car is JUST built I thought you did a hell of a job with it.  It's a feisty bastard.

[Danny Steyn]

Fun to watch from the other perspective. Interesting how all the big slides don't look that big on camera  - they just feel big in the car. I can tell you I was all over the wheel in the carousel hanging on and the speed differential shows. T3 and T6 were especially bad for me as well. But T5, T7, and kink were really good. Probably a little to do with the way I set my car up for the dry vs. Danny, and partly due to the tires (new vs. old rains).

 

Yes Todd, it appeared that you were catching in the braking zones, especially in T5, and I attributed that to the newer rains, which are amazing under braking. I was very surprised at how much more speed I was able to carry through the carousel without getting the tail out, yet your car seemed to be very tail happy through the carousel.

 

Also initially you were killing me through the kink, but I started to man up later in the race. Tread depth might have played a part there but I was never on the limit like you were a couple of times, I had to grow a pair first! Maybe my fright on the first lap through the kink at the 2011 Runoffs was still fresh in my mind!  (watch from 2:44!!!)

 

T12 was still a rim shot, and keeping you tight helped me get the runs there, and in the wet practice session I had figured out that I could take T13 flat in 3rd gear right in the rim, almost in the grass, so that was where I was hoping to make my pass. 

 

And for those that don't know Todd, he is one hell of a quick study and will often let you get ahead to see what you are doing and then adapt his approach and make up significant time. Not showing him everything I had in those early laps was very hard to do!!!

[Think Racing]

Interesting how all the big slides don't look that big on camera - they just feel big in the car.

I love this quote. I just built a 4' tall 20' long mini skate ramp for my boy and have been skating it myself with him as a 40+ wishing it was '85 all over again. I can tell you I swear I'm shredding it and maybe I'm doing ok, but the video clearly demonstrates that I'm a geriatric who thinks he's cool all in his head. Hahaha.

Todd, you know I'm a fan, so thanks to you guys for entertaining the masses. Great race.