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Mid West Council SM2 Class: Spec Miata on 200tw tires

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#1
gerglmuff2

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well, they are gonna try it. 


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#2
Steve Scheifler

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well, they are gonna try it.

Cool! I’m very fond of MCSCC. It will be interesting to see how SM2 fits into their run groups and whether the total SM/SM2 entries becomes a net gain. Thanks in no small part to the late great Dave Wheeler and Advanced Autosports SM has been their most consistently competitive class for many years. Hopefully this new class will expand the appeal and bring more NA cars back out of hiding.
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#3
Tom Sager

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The NA6 gets to add a header.

 

Authorized ModificationsSM2 cars will adhere to all rules as listed in the Midwestern Council of Sports Car Clubs GCR for Spec Miata with the following exceptions.4.1Engine4.1.1Exhaust System4.1.1.11.6L (1990-1993): May use exhaust header, part number #56005, from Racing Beat. This is the only approved header and is allowed for 1.6L engines only.4.1.2Tires4.1.2.1Tires must be size 205/50R15with a tread wear rating of 190or higher.

 

Anyone know what that adds in terms of power?

 

NA8 get to run with no plate and 2350 pounds. 

 

If there are split starts that should put SM behind SM2 :lol:

 

Will be interesting to see how this does as a class, although I still favor cheap power enhancements for the 1.6 along with a little extra weight and a slight weight reduction on the NA8 (2375) to bring all the cars to even better competitive balance in a single class.

 

The tire rule 190TW or higher could be a big plus once the tire choices are sorted out. 


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#4
Steve Scheifler

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What are the odds that Advanced Autosport didn’t play a prominent role in defining the rules and doesn’t already have dyno numbers, and a ready supply of headers? :)
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#5
Jamz14

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Will be interesting to see how this does as a class, although I still favor cheap power enhancements for the 1.6 along with a little extra weight and a slight weight reduction on the NA8 (2375) to bring all the cars to even better competitive balance in a single class.
 
[size=4]The tire rule 190TW or higher could be a big plus once the tire choices are sorted out. 


Why 2375 for the na 1.8? Why not back to how it was at 2350? What data showed that 2400 was too much?

Now the 1.6 gets a header. This after the 1.6 was supposedly "balanced" with the nb. So the 1.6 gets even more power and they only pull 25lbs back from where it used to be? Doesnt make sense to me unless people realized that the full 50 they put on was a mistake.

I'm not wrong am I that the na1.8 used to be at 2350 and not 2375 correct?

Pull the weight out of the na 1.8 and allow us to run solid lash adjusters is what I think . While we are at it, allow valve shims to keep the motors retaining all the spring pressure we are entitled to from the springs we are allowed and as if we had new valve seats . That would save people money on valves. While we are at it: allow us aftermarket valves that are in stock and cost $7 each instead of backordered valves at $23 each.

But I'm crazy.
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#6
Tom Sager

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Why 2375 for the na 1.8? Why not back to how it was at 2350? What data showed that 2400 was too much?

Now the 1.6 gets a header. This after the 1.6 was supposedly "balanced" with the nb. So the 1.6 gets even more power and they only pull 25lbs back from where it used to be? Doesnt make sense to me unless people realized that the full 50 they put on was a mistake.

I'm not wrong am I that the na1.8 used to be at 2350 and not 2375 correct?

Pull the weight out of the na 1.8 and allow us to run solid lash adjusters is what I think . While we are at it, allow valve shims to keep the motors retaining all the spring pressure we are entitled to from the springs we are allowed and as if we had new valve seats . That would save people money on valves. While we are at it: allow us aftermarket valves that are in stock and cost $7 each instead of backordered valves at $23 each.

But I'm crazy.

Didn't want to turn this into a parity debate.  NA8 was at 2350 but had 47mm plate.  Not competitive at those specs.  Removing the plate and leaving it at 2350 would make it the top car IMO.  Won't comment beyond that. 

 

Advanced Autosports probably gave input and they've been a great partner with Midwestern Council over the years.  Dave was really involved and Ben has probably continued that.  Maybe he'll comment. 


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#7
Steve Scheifler

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Why 2375 for the na 1.8? Why not ...


That didn’t take long!!!
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#8
tylerbrown

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Five weekends at Blackhawk Farms and one at the Milwaukee Mile... Unfortunately they are not going to Road America and Gateway like they were originally planning so the schedule is not very well rounded with tracks.

 

I am still hoping MCSCC manages to work something out with IMSA to get us as a support series again at Road America. Unfortunately the rain last year put a big damper on the spectacle.


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#9
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I I remember correctly the Autobahn Country Club Spec Miata series has/had a header. Don't remember which header.

 

Below scroll to post number 2 and compare the numbers, engine work completed by JPM for Mazda. Configuration  #2 using Jackson Racing header.

 

https://mazdaracers....6-data-testing/

 

James, you'll never race with these people from Midwestern Council therefore don't sweat it. SCCA will likely never follow Midwestern Council rules. Midwestern Council likes to please the majority of their customers and they run a great series. Hey, my 1.6 had it's 1 and only win in a Council race (9 SM) and finished in mixed race group 2nd to 2 ITS cars. People came looking/asking after the race, how'd you get so fast, hey, it wasn't me, did you check out the helmet color of who was driving. Nice job Kenny K. 


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#10
Jamz14

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The point wasn't whether I will ever race with them. You are right , I won't. I care about my situation. If I can use others to advance MY cause, I will.

You help make my point. These people find parity at 2375 and I believe no plate. The boys at advance that people above mention have given input and to be respected. So why are respected people at different spec for parity? I find there might be value in their perspective, especially since it aligns with mine.

Way back my opinion was that it was wrong to try and make the na1.8 equal by improving one thing and degrading another at the same time. Dont have a lot of confidence in that. Improve little things over time instead of trying to create a magical witches brew of improvements and shackles.
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#11
Jim Drago

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Didn't want to turn this into a parity debate.  NA8 was at 2350 but had 47mm plate.  Not competitive at those specs.  Removing the plate and leaving it at 2350 would make it the top car IMO.  Won't comment beyond that. 

 

You mean kind of like it was a top car at 2020 Runoffs where it was 2400 lbs and finished p2 by inches? :) 


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#12
Jim Drago

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Pull the weight out of the na 1.8 and allow us to run solid lash adjusters is what I think . While we are at it, allow valve shims to keep the motors retaining all the spring pressure we are entitled to from the springs we are allowed and as if we had new valve seats . That would save people money on valves. While we are at it: allow us aftermarket valves that are in stock and cost $7 each instead of backordered valves at $23 each.

 

How about a turbo and sequential gear boxes? :)


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#13
Ron Alan

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SM2 SM2 SM2...different 1 off class in 1 region! Can do what they want!

 

In hind sight...keep 47mm plate and reduce weight to 2325. Or I'm still with Tom...2375 as is! Stir stir

 

At one point in time Jim...Todd also did very well in his 1.6 at RA...after which I believe it was given some help? Maybe we can continue that pattern in another 3 years when SMAC visits this again :) No doubt one great finish killed any help for the early 1.8 this year. In fairness, the data reviewed for this car compared to others in the same race, showed it was not deficient. The 99 and vvt cars that were used as a comparison we dont know who they belonged to...unless I missed that information during the SMAC meeting I and others were allowed to sit in on. Regardless, I give the SMAC credit for their due diligence and their transparency in sharing with those who wrote letters! 


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#14
Jim Drago

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SM2 SM2 SM2...different 1 off class in 1 region! Can do what they want!

 

In hind sight...keep 47mm plate and reduce weight to 2325. Or I'm still with Tom...2375 as is! Stir stir

 

At one point in time Jim...Todd also did very well in his 1.6 at RA...after which I believe it was given some help? Maybe we can continue that pattern in another 3 years when SMAC visits this again :) No doubt one great finish killed any help for the early 1.8 this year. In fairness, the data reviewed for this car compared to others in the same race, showed it was not deficient. The 99 and vvt cars that were used as a comparison we dont know who they belonged to...unless I missed that information during the SMAC meeting I and others were allowed to sit in on. Regardless, I give the SMAC credit for their due diligence and their transparency in sharing with those who wrote letters! 

 

And I still contend that their is about 3 people( or less)  in the entire class that can tell the difference in 25 lbs, or any of the combinations you laid out above :) 


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#15
Ron Alan

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And I still contend that their is about 3 people( or less)  in the entire class that can tell the difference in 25 lbs, or any of the combinations you laid out above :)

Perfect...then no one should argue! Hmmm...lets make it 50lbs :)


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#16
infamousjim

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Oh man, VERY interested to hear how the 200tw works out. 


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#17
Tom Sager

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You mean kind of like it was a top car at 2020 Runoffs where it was 2400 lbs and finished p2 by inches? :)

I said I wouldn't comment further so you got me there. 


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#18
Jim Drago

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Perfect...then no one should argue! Hmmm...lets make it 50lbs :)

See at 50, even I could tell :)


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#19
Bench Racer

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And I still contend that their is about 3 people( or less)  in the entire class that can tell the difference in 25 lbs,

I'd bet less than than 3. Maybe only you. That's like the trashing the 25 pounds back and forth for the 1.6 a few years ago. :rotfl:


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#20
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I said I wouldn't comment further so you got me there. 

A man of his word. :)


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