12 replies to this topic

[Dave532]

Hello,
First time poster here but experienced in SCCA rally and NASA road racing but never SCCA road racing.
I am helping a buddy finish a Spec Miata last logbooked in 06.

I 99% sure I know we need to update the cage but just want to throw it by you guys:

The car has an Autopower bolt-in cage that was legal as of 2006. It has only one tube across
each door opening. According to the GCR, As of 2007, it requires 2 tubes across the
door opening.
Is there a grandfather ruling in SCCA which allows cages of a certain age to not require
updating?

We are still going to update the cage as it is the right thing to do but I would
just like to know where the car stands right now, legality-wise.

Thanks,

-Dave

[William Bonsell]

I too still possess an Autopower bolt in cage. The car came that way. I did have to add an additional bar on both driver and passenger side. You can make the driver side "nascar" style or not, but you will need to double up on both sides.I've had no problem with SCCA tech for two years now.

[Dave532]

I too still possess an Autopower bolt in cage. The car came that way. I did have to add an additional bar on both driver and passenger side. You can make the driver side "nascar" style or not, but you will need to double up on both sides.I've had no problem with SCCA tech for two years now.

Excellent.

Thanks for the confirmation.

-Dave

[Chris Adams]

NASA also requires 360 degree welds throughout and they check for it... not sure if that an issue, but I thought I'd mention it before the tech people complain.

[Tom Hampton]

NASA also requires 360 degree welds throughout and they check for it... not sure if that an issue, but I thought I'd mention it before the tech people complain.

Since, I haven't been through tech before...and I'm getting closer to being ready to do it....I'm curious what that statement means: "and they check for it." Does that mean they get out a mirror and ensure that every single weld goes 360 degrees around the joint? Since, I had my cage welded...I'd like to pre-tech everything I can. Guess that means I need a mirror and flashlight.

The thing that would worry me would be: what if I found something? It would probably have been for some inability to get the weld tip to it....How much trouble would I have to go to to fix it. Cutting holes in the body to get to it and welding a patch later?

[Chris Adams]

Since, I haven't been through tech before...and I'm getting closer to being ready to do it....I'm curious what that statement means: "and they check for it." Does that mean they get out a mirror and ensure that every single weld goes 360 degrees around the joint? Since, I had my cage welded...I'd like to pre-tech everything I can. Guess that means I need a mirror and flashlight.

The thing that would worry me would be: what if I found something? It would probably have been for some inability to get the weld tip to it....How much trouble would I have to go to to fix it. Cutting holes in the body to get to it and welding a patch later?

I don;t think they will do a "fine tooth and comb" on it, but anywhere they can see they will look. No, they didn't use a mirror on mine, but they did ask about it :/

[davew]

Several years ago, we held a tech day at the shop for NASA. One of the Camaro's that had been racing for years, was found to not have 360* welds where the cage side meet the main hoop. We took the biggest hole saw we had and drilled to holes in the roof, welded the 1/4 inch gap and tach welded the roof plugs back in place. the driver then did a proper body repair at home.

Never underestimate the power of a tech guy

Dave

[Tom Hampton]

I don't want to be "that" guy.

[dstevens]

You don't want to be the guy who's cage fails... For the stock cars they don't let us cut the roof like Dave did so we would tack the cage together, take out the tacked footings and hole saw through the floor and drop the cage down enough to weld around each member then pull the cage back up and reinstall the footings. I didn't find anyplace on the Miata I couldn't get a 100 series gun around the full joint. A 250 amp class might have been a bit tougher but still doable.

I thought there was a section in the cage regs in the main CCR/GCR that call out for the inspector to be able to at least feel around the joint to see that's it's complete but I can't find it. Before you roll through feel around each bead and you should be able to see if they are all complete.

[Dave532]

The experienced tech guys know exactly where to check...where the joints are close to the body and difficult to reach with a MIG.
I've brought a welder to every event I've participated in...it was used 3 times to complete welds on other
cages...1 rally and 2 road races.

One other trick to get to a hard-to-reach spot is by bending the rod when using an arc welder.

-Dave
#532

[Dave532]

I too still possess an Autopower bolt in cage. The car came that way. I did have to add an additional bar on both driver and passenger side. You can make the driver side "nascar" style or not, but you will need to double up on both sides.I've had no problem with SCCA tech for two years now.

Another more detailed question if you don't mind...

The rule:
D. SIDE PROTECTION
Two side tubes connecting the front and main hoops across both door
openings are mandatory. Tubes that are welded to any part of the
same mounting plate are considered to be connected to one another
(see 9.4.E.3 below).

I was planning to run another tube parallel to the existing tube.
Welded to the front hoop below the original tube and welded to the
existing rear plate below the original tube.

Does the rule above state that 2 tubes connected to the same plate are considered one tube?

Thanks,

-Dave

[davew]

What the rule means is that 2 tubes that do not physically touch, but are connected to the same plate are considered to be connected.

Autopower kits only come down to the package shelf, yet the mounting plate continues down the rear firwall. Your door bar can connect to the plate. And it is legal, even though it is not actually touching the main hoop. This rule was added specificly to address this issue

Dave

[Dave532]

What the rule means is that 2 tubes that do not physically touch, but are connected to the same plate are considered to be connected.

Autopower kits only come down to the package shelf, yet the mounting plate continues down the rear firwall. Your door bar can connect to the plate. And it is legal, even though it is not actually touching the main hoop. This rule was added specificly to address this issue

Dave

That is what I figured.

Thanks for the confirmation.

-Dave