31 replies to this topic

[Steve S.]

Well, hell, that looks like a no-brainer...

[Keith Novak]

Again, check the regional supps if you want to run both on the same weekend. You can run the car in either class as long as you follow all the rules per the GCR. If you want to run both on the same weekend, some regions have this pesky rule that you must run both in full SM trim.

I'm just being especially clear on the double dipping point since I specifically planned my 1.8 build to not make changes that were ITA prohibited and then remove my plate, etc between sessions to run ITA. I was rather irritated when I found the rule that nixed that little idea. Not sure about the rationale but rules is rules.

[Brian Ghidinelli]

The problem is that a 99 SM without a plate is not a legal ITS car I do not believe. Ride height, valve job, top cut angle, depowered steering rack and removing corner windows are all things that make an SM not legal in IT without a specific supps (like SM -> ITA) or GCR (SM -> STL) allowance. See my thread here: http://mazdaracers.c...p?showtopic=644

Keith - in your case, if you don't have an ITA-prohibited modification, then you don't have to enter as an SM and you CAN remove your plate. I think it's only cars that have a modification in my thread which are no longer legal to enter as a regular IT (or ST) car.

[Johnny D]

The problem is that a 99 SM without a plate is not a legal ITS car I do not believe. Ride height, valve job, top cut angle, depowered steering rack and removing corner windows are all things that make an SM not legal in IT without a specific supps (like SM -> ITA) or GCR (SM -> STL) allowance. See my thread here: http://mazdaracers.c...p?showtopic=644

IMO,
I beleive that is correct, so they have STL now.
It shouldn't be an alternate with ITA/S (in SFR) It should be required, but it's messy.
Sound like STL is the new remade ITA/S class for the nationals.

In the same respect, I think from what I've read, sorry, I haven't read the SCCA rules so.
Can't you run a miata that's not a SM in STL?
This shouldn't be allowed or needs a different class.
J~

[Mike Colangelo]

In the same respect, I think from what I've read, sorry, I haven't read the SCCA rules so.
Can't you run a miata that's not a SM in STL?
This shouldn't be allowed or needs a different class.
J~

Yes. It sounds like a Miata built to the STL rules will be quite more powerful and faster than any SM.

It's a shame that these STL rules require one to "dumb down" the really good OEM (i.e., bone stock) Honda K20 and some B18C motors. I'd rather they "performance balance" with weight.

[colin.koehler]

Thanks Bruce....

I have also posted over on ICSCC to see it they intend to add the STL class to their Group 5 and move all the SM's that run ITA into STL. I don't think SCCA NWR is up to speed on this either. Enjoy your first race weekend. Sunday looks very wet....Hope to see you at Rose Cup.

Bill

Bill, the ICSCC isn't like NASA or SCCA... The "they" is you. ICSCC doesn't create classes, the members do. Please re-read the ICSCC user/rules book and you will find the necessary information you need to create/outline a new class for the ICSCC then submit it. I believe you need 5 other drivers to sign it and then it will be put into effect next year as a trial class. If the class receives enough entries to qualify as a permanent class then it will become so in the subsequent season. If you're "waiting" for the ICSCC to ever create a class, you're going to be waiting a very very long time.... like, forever.

If the STL class were to exist in the ICSCC next year and it became very popular then I might even make the switch, but only if it was more popular than ITA. However, the STL class would definitely appeal to potential new racers as it would allow some Honda people to do engine swaps and run a 200hp CRX/Civic/Integra. I know that when I talk to Honda guys they all want to go racing with "swaps" and I usually tell them that there's not a really good class for that unless they want to racing California in NASA H2 but being able to race locally in STL might bring some more racers to the ICSCC.

A Proper STL Honda would be MUCH faster than a PRO3 car and Possibly too fast for group 5 as I would imagine a 180hp CRX could lap Pacific Raceways below 1:37.


@Michaelangelo: We get another shot at ITX in G2 this year!

[Mike Colangelo]

A Proper STL Honda would be MUCH faster than a PRO3 car and Possibly too fast for group 5 as I would imagine a 180hp CRX could lap Pacific Raceways below 1:37.

Don't give me an excuse to blow up the D16 currently in my CRX!

But, yes, a B18 or even a B16 in a CRX would be awesome!

Maybe Bill is on to something? Hmmm....

[Roadsterx]

A true EIP car would lap PR faster then 1:37's . Jeff ran mid 1:37's with the EIP Datsun Roadster
I have now, and it is basically a vintage car on cantilevers. You have to remember a Pro 3 runs in group 5 as a EIP car. A EIP ( EP SCCA ) Nationals car would crush a Conference group 5 field, so
STL in Group 5 would fit or in Group 1.

[Roadsterx]

Just scanned through the STL rules. It narrows it down to HP/Weight/tire width 225's seem
to be close to the max tire width on a 7" wheel. You could see some interesting combos in that
class. I wonder why the Lotus isn't legal

[Greg Amy]

A quick note for SM'ers running Super Touring Light.

This past weekend a Spec Miata double-dipping in STL at New Hampshire was excluded from the results for failing ride height. I'm getting this info second-/third-hand, but as I understand it he failed post-race tech and was asked, twice, 'are you running SM or STL rules' and replied 'STL'. Since his ride height was below that of the STL rules (5" at rocker) he was excluded. Unfortunately, this was not clarified at the event (I was not there), though (fortunately) the guy was apparently only in it for the track time and got what he wanted/needed.

Note that we changed the STL rules to explicitly allow SM cars to run in STL (March 2011 Fastrack). If you go through tech with a Spec Miata running in STL, and are asked what rules you are prepped to, be sure to let the tech inspector know you're compliant to Spec Miata rules and did not build the car to Super Touring Light rules...

Greg Amy
STL Driver and STAC member

[Alberto]

This whole thing is clear as mud

[Johnny D]

This whole thing is clear as mud

I wouldn't worry about it in SFR.
SFR is giving away the $$$ in ITA and SM, (which you already received),
J~