38 replies to this topic

[William Bonsell]

In an effort to increase entries, someone is certainly thinking outside the box on this one. This definitely has merits and there has been a pretty healthy discussion over on the ICSCC forum regarding endurance race entries specifically, but also dealing with increasing the base. As far as this going forward within SCCA Oregon (and hopefully NWR follows), this is a great way to introduce many of those CC and LeMons participants to Club Racing. I applaud whoever ran with this and made it happen. Should be fun.

Bill-

[Johnny D]

This one ??, link ?
J~

[Mike Collins]

Sounds like IT-JUNK. not sure how it works but I doubt a lot of those cars will get log books?????

[Bruce Wilson]

Yeah, I like it... I know of one 99 protege with Lemons champ provenance that should easily get a logbook

-bw

[Terrell Garrett]

Personally think it's a great way to get more people interested and possibly moving up into other classes (SM preferably).

Received an e-mail today that they will be included in the March school. Will they have their own run group like open wheel? I am sure many of these cars are very safe but I have significant concerns about the weight factor as some of these cars are very heavy compared to the Miatas and could cause big damage in a collision. As my 17 year-old daughter plans on entering the school I need some more information before I let her out there with a 5,000 pound iron beast. Perhaps Brian or Sean can weigh in on this?

Somewhat related my daughter received a '91 for Christmas. The car is already gutted and the brake system is replaced. This weekend is hubs, studs, and starting the cage. She is doing 90% of the work and if she passes the test will be welding her own cage under very close supervision (she stick welded for us last summer). I don't know how far or where this will go but she is very attentive, wants to learn the how and why, and doesn't mind getting her knuckles scraped. This kid worked in an intense recycle yard and mastered a track hoe at 13. She has proven her work ethic, hand/eye coordination, and guts. She would greatly appreciate any help or advice given. My main job is to be the supportive Dad and not push her but let her find her own path. Also, of course to provide the $$$$$$$!

[Keith Novak]

I'm not sold on the idea yet. Some of those cars are actually quite good. A couple already race in whatever class they fit. The real junkers have me more concerned. They can pass whatever safety inspection, but many are prone to grenading engine related parts and fluids all over the track. They should hold up better over 30 minute races but I'll hold off on an actual endorsement until I see we don't wind up with an inch of speed dry on the track at the end of race weekends. The officials will also need to be very firm about anyone who doesn't really care about putting a dent in their POS while tangling with some rather nice race cars.

There likely won't be enough of them to have their own run group so I'd suspect they'll go in group 7.

[William Bonsell]

Yeah, it's my understanding they go into group 7...and you could actually do a split start with the IT-J cars in the back...at least that gives the main group a chance to avoid any 1st lap issues which might be caused by cars which, in some instances, will be significantly heavier than all of the other cars...such as Crown Vics and Taurus's....I also think these cars would be running on street tires if they adhere to CC rules. But it would certainly create a little bit of curiousity and no doubt bring a few of those guys into a club racing environment....I think it might be a good thing, but we'll just have to see.

Bill-.

[Randy Thieme]

I understand a desire to recruit new drivers but I'm a little leery of the cars. Echoing Terrells' concern, not just for students but even for experienced drivers going side-by-side through a turn with a car more than twice as heavy lacks appeal.

Although it is likely they will be added to Group 7 ITE runs in Group 3 so there is precedent for an IT class to run elsewhere. But there's no chance ITJ will be added to Group 3 so it's most likely Group 7. IMO I would rather see them have their own run group like Vintage. Also agree with Keith's concern over grenading parts leaving oil. Anyone remember last year when our first session of the season was in the rain with kitty litter the whole way around?

Maybe there should be some sort of rule where after a year either ( A ) you commit the car to ITJ and abandon racing it in Chump/Lemons or ( B ) it goes back to racing Chump/Lemons and is not allowed on course the following year. Otherwise this is going to turn into a perpetual junk car class.

[Bruce Wilson]

Somewhat related my daughter received a '91 for Christmas...

Awesome Terrell! You and Tom are better fathers than I'll ever be

[Bruce Wilson]

They should hold up better over 30 minute races but I'll hold off on an actual endorsement until I see we don't wind up with an inch of speed dry on the track at the end of race weekends.

Hey, anyone ever wonder why SM always follows vintage??? Just have to wonder if that is someone's sense of humor, or they just think we're the best drivers to handle whatever pools of fluid and/or miscelaneous parts being left about!

[Bruce Wilson]

And finally, I think I saw some "racecars" at the last Chumpcar race that would rival some SCCA/Conference regular racers hands down. Not sure what the "rules" really are in either chumpcar or lemons, but I'm certain there are some that cost a bit more than $500. On the other hand, that 99 Protoge that won the innaugural T-Hill Lemons race was a true $500 car!

[Keith Novak]

There are some really good beaters out there that run race after race. Ours might eventually be a contender if we've finally sorted out the electrical system and it was hanging with the Datsun that turned 1:33s or :34s on street tires in the dry. It's raced conference but was hard to class with all the windows removed. I did alright in it despite driving in a river of oil.

Tech will need to give them a good hard inspection though. I've seen enough of ones spilling gas, blowing up on out laps, etc. that my concern is all the other classes will get fed up with the schedule being thrown out the window every time the Junk class hits the track unless there's some sort of weeding out process.

[Jim Boemler]

Hey, anyone ever wonder why SM always follows vintage??? Just have to wonder if that is someone's sense of humor, or they just think we're the best drivers to handle whatever pools of fluid and/or miscelaneous parts being left about!

No, they figure we're the most disposable.

[Mike Collins]

Here lies the problem with the SCCA. Unlike other organizations that actually focus on what they do well, the SCCA wants to be everything for everybody. Focus on making your club racing events stellar and people will want to race real race cars, not crap cars.

[LarryKing]

Focus on making your club racing events stellar and people will want to race real race cars, not crap cars.

The Moose concurs.

[William Bonsell]

Here lies the problem with the SCCA. Unlike other organizations that actually focus on what they do well, the SCCA wants to be everything for everybody. Focus on making your club racing events stellar and people will want to race real race cars, not crap cars.

MIke..This is just a specific regions attempt to bring into the fold some addtional entries via this very unique class. Will it work? Who knows, but with declining entries due in part to the economy as well as other racing avenues in the Pacific Northwest, I think it's a pretty "out of the box" move. And I know that not all CC or LeMons cars are truly "crap can" racers. Obviously, some tech and driving issues have to be sorted out, but if it helps grow entries and therefore makes the region more fiscally sound, then that's a good thing. SM and SRF groups are decently populated, but after that class car counts get a bit thin. If you have any other thoughts on how to grow entries, or what has worked in other regions, I am sure the powers to be here in the Northwest would love to hear them.

Bill-

[Bruce Wilson]

Understand what you guys are saying Mike and Moose, and I'm sure you aren't intending to diss our region, BUT Oregon region is one of the best in the country. We are a very small market in terms of population, income, unemployment, yet do quite well compared to the Seattle and SoCal and many other regions. I support Jim Weidenbaum's (new RRD) leadership and ability to think out of the box... well maybe not the drifting part -- can we make those guys use quiet tires

[Mike Collins]

Bruce you know me. Not intended as an Oregon slight at all. I understand the need to want more entries and look at it as a potential revenue generator. However I think the loss in market share, competiting organizations and lack of entries are not entirely due to economic circumstances. The SCCA should focus on what it does, be the best at it and then and only then will its market share increase. If we continue to look at stop gap, loss prevention type things we are cheapening what we do. All we need to do is be the best, offer the best product experience and value and attandence will increase. I am not a fan of the crap can class, even some folks think there cars are "OK" or safe.

[Rob Burgoon]

For a club that has more obits than new members, I applaud an effort to bring in new blood that might actually succeed.

[Michael Colangelo]

For a club that has more obits than new members, I applaud an effort to bring in new blood that might actually succeed.

Rob, I'd bet that most club racing drivers in the Oregon SCCA are a bit younger than those in CalClub. But, yeah, good point. ;-)