23 replies to this topic

[MPR22]

Apples and oranges, threshold brake some, tap and go or hard on slow off trail. Many types of brake zones its up the racer to figure out what is best. The SOW has we have several brake zones that are of the shut it down stand it on its nose variety.

[SaulSpeedwell]

hmmmmm
The question was - what are the max G's under braking???? Not how to cut fast laps
Max G's occur at threshold

OK, but was it wrong to deduce (<--not the same as assume) the person's goal is to turn fast laps and win races, and their question was prompted from looking at their own on-track data (the original posters's second post said as much?), and not some scientific experiment based on skidpad data?

If there was a Runoffs for maximum braking we'd be setting the car at positive camber (or whatever camber would be "flat" at ~1g), gobs of toe-in, front tires at 40+ psi, rear tires at about 11 psi, put stock pads on the rear (or fudge the prop valve), move all the ballast rearward, set the car on the bumpstops, brace the master cylinder to the shock tower ... and track records would be had during years the Braking Runoffs were held on serrated concrete, and everyone would biatch up a storm in years the Braking Runoffs were held on sealcoated asphalt (or, as they say in Memphis, "ash fault").

(This apple is starting to look like a pomegranate!)

At the Braking Runoffs, the car at "threshold" at one wheel will get beat (every time) by the one that has one wheel locked and smoking but has 3 OTHER wheels at "threshold". (I'm being a little comedically sarcastic here overall, but it is important to understand that WE -racecar drivers - let off the brake pedal when the FIRST wheel locks - and thus, braking is a "lowest common denominator" action that is only as good as our most overbraked wheel lets us be. This is the opposite situation from an ABS car, where the WEAK brake is more likely to be holding us back). Evil frontrunning jerks would cunningly tune each wheel for "threshold" braking for the conditions of the day and the track of the year. % cross would still matter, but only because we'd all be talking about our wheel-to-wheel brake pressure percentages in terms of individual percentages, and half the SMAC would start selling 4-way adjustable proportioning valves! Collins would be in the tech shed simultaneously trying to catch cheaters, get his own car through, and make best friends with the winner!

"The racing line" would be purely determined by maximum "grip" in a straight line, which wouldn't be anywhere near where those silly "orange" racers put their car for their pointless 45 minute multilap-races against each other while they go around corners and shift gears and all that other irrelevant stuff that the original poster obviously doesn't care about

Best of all (!!!), Slattery and Dewhurst would never stop talking about the superior brake balance of the 99s, even after Buras took a 1.6 and came within 2 feet of winning the Braking June Sprints

***Edited to comply with new kindler/gentler usage rules, and I mean that in a good Christian way ...

Edited by SaulSpeedwell, 07-08-2012 12:33 PM.

[Neil O]

What I really want to know is......what Saul has to say on his favorite golf forum.

I bet we appreciate him more here.

[Jamz14]

Saul,

I understand what you are saying and where you are coming from, but I was looking for a max number reference point to have some idea where the car was in relationship to the max point from looking at the data. I didn't say that in asking , my goal and intention was trying to achieve this under every and all circumstances.

I have some data with some numbers. I am not in the car with the young driver. I don't know how his braking is except some long g numbers from one weekend and some video. I could take the car out as some have suggested and get this data , ( and as pointed out, intend to ). But other peoples experience and data sure helps me fast track a bit in looking at and interpreting the lines on the data. It was such a simple question,,,,with so many assumptions on why I asked.

Thanks Danny for the reference numbers.