88 replies to this topic

[Mike Asselta]

SM has achieved remarkable goals with regard to creating outstanding competition, excellent drivers, and rewarding teamwork.  It is one of the most successful National classes in SCCA history and the most equalized without starting with a kit car (like SRF).  

 

The great news is that it is still gaining momentum, with respect to these specific goals, with no sign of weakening.  Hat's off to the thousands of drivers over the last 10-12 years that have made contributions and developed one of the best racing classes anywhere.  No one who loves racing should stand in the way of years of continued success for Spec Miata.

 

Just like the amazingly successful Apple i-Tunes has created opportunity for great services like Pandora and Spotify, the success of SM has created such opportunities and a roadmap for additional proposals.

 

This is a place to dream about capitalizing on those opportunities.  I'll get it started by stating and addressing a specific opportunity:  

 

CREATE A CLASS THAT EMPHASIZES DRIVER DEVELOPMENT IN SAFE, FUN CARS THAT MAINTAIN A RELATIVELY LOW  COST OF ENTRY (UNDER $20,000) AND CREATES HIGHLY COMPETITIVE RACING.

 

Proposal #1:  Build or buy a B-Spec car.  Fully-prepped cars are already available at this price and donor cars are coming down in price as consumer models age.  The clubs and manufacturers are committed to equalization as demonstrated in the off-season work already done.  The simple rule-set and use of rewards weight in some series should keep these cars affordable and somewhat equalized, with allowances for different tracks that may reward one car or another.  National class with a televised Pro Racing Series already in place!

 

Proposal #2:  Make 90-97 SM's allowable in the HP class, with no allowable changes from SM drive train or suspensions.  Tires, wheels, flywheels, areo, ride height, etc. would be free.  At last year's Run-Offs on a track that amplifies small differences, the leading first generation SM would have been 5th on the grid without the benefit of an open race tire, flywheel or aero.  STL is open to SM cars now, but requires additional development for the 90-97 to be competitive.  Championship National Class already in place!

 

NOTE:  I don't mean to sidestep all of the SM controversy, only to address the elephant in the room, which is that many people are chapped at the expense of running upfront in SM.  It's not going to change in the near future, nor should it change because its working on many levels.  Anyone that wants to be affiliated with one of the finest and most competitive racing families anywhere, regardless of their finishing position, should continue to be part of the SM field, with all of its spoken and unspoken benefits in the community, paddock and on the racetrack.

 

Long live Spec Miata!  Long live club racing!

 

Moderator:  please move SM parity replies to the appropriate thread

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jim Drago]

One such proposal that is floating around.. With Club racing moving to majors and "club racing next year.. Perhaps it is time to turn SM into 99/05 only for majors and Runoffs, 2400 no plate.  And for club racing, make the rules what they are now, but severely handicap or the 99/05 cars, Where the cost of the cars competing will be closer to 10k, than 40 k. If we handicap the Majors cars with say 100 lbs and or smaller plates, they will be at a severe disadvantage, regardless of the amount of money spent.  

That would allow the front running SM crowd to continue in a more spec class than ever, a faster car which will compete against the new SRF as it will definitely be pulling from SM entries.  The club racing class will be more like the Sm of old, more grass roots, regional championships etc.  Obviously this would be for 15 or 16 if even a viable idea. I race teh SM at 2400 and no plate, it is a lot of fun.

 

Just a thought

[JBlaisdell]

Gulp...I can't believe I'm reading this...one the best ideas I've heard on this site in the last 5 yrs.

Let me pull my plate and go faster...I'm all in!!!

Thanks Jim...

[JRHille]

Jim that would be great as there are obviously very few who feel their antique cars can be competitive at a major race anyway..................

[cam]

This is properly a controversial suggestion but still a serious suggestion that was floated several years ago. Allow any Miata from 90 – 05 with no plate, all the same weight (how about 2350) and allow all to use the NB drive train and suspension.  So a 1.6 would be allowed to upgrade to the 99 up style motors, sub frames, and control arms (and other related parts like steering rack etc..).  Basically, all cars would be the same except for some would have pop-up head lights and some will have the curved headlights.  This way, it really would be a spec class again.  I would also suggest allowing the use of 1.6 and the lesser 1.8 but everyone is the same weight and no plate.   To be competitive, one would naturally migrate to the 99 + style upgrades.

 

If someone with a pre 99 does not want to do the 99 upgrade, then the 1.6 and NA 1.8 has a home in STL or ITA or as an uncompetitive SM.

It would be nice if both SCCA and NASA did this at the same time, I would end up racing with which every club did this first.

 

[High Chair]

One such proposal that is floating around.. With Club racing moving to majors and "club racing next year.. Perhaps it is time to turn SM into 99/05 only for majors and Runoffs, 2400 no plate.  And for club racing, make the rules what they are now, but severely handicap or the 99/05 cars, Where the cost of the cars competing will be closer to 10k, than 40 k. If we handicap the Majors cars with say 100 lbs and or smaller plates, they will be at a severe disadvantage, regardless of the amount of money spent.  

That would allow the front running SM crowd to continue in a more spec class than ever, a faster car which will compete against the new SRF as it will definitely be pulling from SM entries.  The club racing class will be more like the Sm of old, more grass roots, regional championships etc.  Obviously this would be for 15 or 16 if even a viable idea. I race teh SM at 2400 and no plate, it is a lot of fun.

 

Just a thought

I have to agree! I think it is time to separate the 99/05 from the rest of the cars. The vast majority of the cars at the national level in the SE are 99s with a few 01s mixed in. At this point I see no reason we should be running extra weight and plates just to keep us in line with a 20 year old car. 

[DrDomm]

A class of only 99-05‘s without a restrictor? Wow, I'm pretty sure I suggested that before and got shot down. Sounds like fun.

(Yes, I also suggested including SM5 cars more recently, as well)

[Tom Sager]

I think the 99-05 class is counter to what SCCA is trying to do by removing the regional and national designation.  If the class is organized in this way then you're excluding owners of NA cars from a runoffs opportunity and likely reducing car counts at both majors and club races.  Essentially you end up splitting the class which has been an un-curable  SCCA disease for decades IMO.  That might also be the difference between SM getting its own race group or not at either type of event.  

 

Prediction:  If this is done, NASA will not follow suit and will benefit from keeping SM as a single class. 

[Jim Drago]

I think the 99-05 class is counter to what SCCA is trying to do by removing the regional and national designation.  If the class is organized in this way then you're excluding owners of NA cars from a runoffs opportunity and likely reducing car counts at both majors and club races.  Essentially you end up splitting the class which has been an un-curable  SCCA disease for decades IMO.  That might also be the difference between SM getting its own race group or not at either type of event.  

 

Prediction:  If this is done, NASA will not follow suit and will benefit from keeping SM as a single class. 

That is definitely the potential downside and I don't disagree. We would need to see how many 90-97 cars are even participating now and see if it is something worth doing. or not. Certainly would eliminate all the parity squabbles. 

 

 

You completely missed the reasoning behind what the club was doing combining national/regional racing.  That line once a big distinction has become almost non existent and will be the same next year. The majors will be "national" racing of the 80's and 90's. We just had way too many National races and it blurred the lines by diluting them. 

[William Bonsell]

Pretty sure the fastest cars on the West Coast are still 1.6's. not sure why, but may have something to do with the fact that very few drivers head East for the run offs. Now if the run offs were on the west coast every other year, that would probably change I would think. And there are some very fast 1.6's out here. You guys back East just never see them.

[Jim Drago]

 Now if the run offs were on the west coast every other year, that would probably change I would think.

 

 

You may just get your wish. I know that is being talked about. 

Jim

[Rob Burgoon]

One such proposal that is floating around.. With Club racing moving to majors and "club racing next year.. Perhaps it is time to turn SM into 99/05 only for majors and Runoffs, 2400 no plate.  And for club racing, make the rules what they are now, but severely handicap or the 99/05 cars, Where the cost of the cars competing will be closer to 10k, than 40 k. If we handicap the Majors cars with say 100 lbs and or smaller plates, they will be at a severe disadvantage, regardless of the amount of money spent.  

That would allow the front running SM crowd to continue in a more spec class than ever, a faster car which will compete against the new SRF as it will definitely be pulling from SM entries.  The club racing class will be more like the Sm of old, more grass roots, regional championships etc.  Obviously this would be for 15 or 16 if even a viable idea. I race teh SM at 2400 and no plate, it is a lot of fun.

 

Just a thought

 

Jim, haven't you said yourself that a big part of the appeal of a 99 is the fact that you don't have to find perfect manifolds?  You pull the plate and the "easy to prep 99" gets harder.

[Bench Racer]

 We would need to see how many 90-97 cars are even participating now and see if it is something worth doing. or not. Certainly would eliminate all the parity squabbles. 

 

Gee, to bad no one paid attention several years ago when  a letter was forwarded to the CRB on this ^ exact issue (car identification/count per spec line/per event). Naw, don't need facts, hyperbole fills the bill. If not fill the site with a

[Jamz14]

If the cars are on par as everyone has told me, why the need to split the class?

[Bench Racer]

If the cars are on par as everyone has told me, why the need to split the class?

Please re-read post number two and if you don't understand, through a pm send your e-mail address and I'll help you undertsnd post number two.

 

I am amazed the 1.6er's and the 1.8er's haven't viewed post number two and commented.

[Rob Burgoon]

To address the OP, the class you're asking for is spec miata.  Not B spec or HP.

 

B spec is a party of wrong wheel drive slugs with cars with much worse parity that will get screwed up again... what... every 3 years for each make?

 

HP?  Where they already wouldn't be competitive?

 

You're probably looking for ITA or PTE if you want cheaper prep.

[Jim Drago]

A class of only 99-05‘s without a restrictor? Wow, I'm pretty sure I suggested that before and got shot down. Sounds like fun.

(Yes, I also suggested including SM5 cars more recently, as well)

 

Domm

starting from a blank piece of paper it is a no brainer.. The issue is the cars out there and dollars spent and where will these other cars go etc. It is not something that will likely happen, but the idea has been out there for years. DDG suggested it in 08 or 09?

Jim

[LarryKing]

I am amazed the 1.6er's and the 1.8er's haven't viewed post number two and commented.

 

Just because I understand doesn't mean that I care.

[Brandon]

I think to try and streamline any class changes into the Majors push (as an effort to "nationalize" national-level racing) will cause significant angst and be counter to the National Office's goals (reinforce the preeminence of the SCCA Runoffs while improving participation - this is just my take-away on this push of the Majors program).

 

Instead of splitting the class (which I think everyone would agree is not a good idea), why not establish at some point in the future, everyone will be running the same powertrain as suggested?

 

I happen to like the idea of an identical powertrain under all years/models** however making it happen overnight wouldn't be feasible (cost/parts availability) and there still would be people who won't want spend the money to do so and calling for their own class/playground.  This is where the secondary classification would come in and put those NA SMs (running their proper-year driveline) into an FP/GP/HP designation** after that point.

 

"SMAC - Beginning in 2015 you can run a 99-05 powertrain in any model year Miata (90-2005).  This includes blah, blah, blah, blah...."

"PAC - Beginning in 2015 you can run any 90-97 model Miata in '2014-vintage SM' dress.  This includes blah, blah, blah, blah..."

 

I leave it up to the rule wordsmiths to figure out how to make it sound right & proper within the GCR.

 

** The actual designation/description of what that powertrain consists of is left up for discussion.  However, with the need to no longer balance across 3 very different engine/chassis characteristics this should not be much of a problem barring any anomalous aero differences at potentially higher speeds they could conceivably achieve.

 

Similarly for the "Production classification" between the 1.6 & 1.8 models you could conceivably remove the restrictor and alter weights accordingly to ensure parity/competitiveness in whichever class they end up in.

 

My $.02 (and I'm willing to write the CRB to gauge their interest if anyone else wanted to).

Brandon

[Jamz14]

Bench,

 

I know not what I say. I am sure everything is square.