Jump to content

Photo

Grill screen type

- - - - -

  • Please log in to reply
139 replies to this topic

#121
Todd Lamb

Todd Lamb

    Driver Coach // Racer

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 980 posts
  • Location:Atlanta, GA
We taped the screen for years and years. Then it randomly became a rule due to prod classes.

Seems to me that if there are letters asking for the rule to be changed back, the CRB needs to consider it. Or Wheel are you saying you have the sole and final call on this matter?

Full disclosure: SMAC chairman, my opinions do not reflect anything to do with the SMAC unless specifically stated.

Todd Lamb
Atlanta Speedwerks
www.atlspeedwerks.com
SpeedShift Transmissions - reliability and performance

Spec Miata / Spec Boxster / Spec Cayman specialist

Spec MX-5 Challenge Series Director

Global MX-5 Cup team

MX5 Cup Champion - Has won a Season in the MX5 Cup Survive the 25, NASA Thunderhill - Survive the 25, NASA Thunderhill NASA Champs Winner - NASA Champs Winner ARRC Champion - Won the ARRC Race in a Spec Miata We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata Donor - Made PayPal donation Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner Majors Winner - World Challenge Winner - World Challenge Winner

#122
Andrew Charbonneau

Andrew Charbonneau

    Royal P.I.T.A.

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 912 posts
  • Location:delray biatch florida
  • Region:83
  • Car Year:1967
  • Car Number:67

Thank you for the explanations. Personally I dont care either way. I dont think moving from tape to no tape has or will change my finishing position. Whatever the rule is is what I will do. I do wish I would have known all this a few years ago, I would have been trying to run more tape!

sorry craig you always had it but you were left out of the loop second place is ok first looser lol magic man  :rotfl:


  • Tom Hampton likes this
Satire is primarily a literary genre or form, although in practice it can also be found in the graphic and performing arts. In satire, vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, and society itself, into improvement.[1] Although satire is usually meant to be funny, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit as a weapon.
SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America Survivalist - Won 25 Hours at Thunderhill! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other

#123
Andrew Charbonneau

Andrew Charbonneau

    Royal P.I.T.A.

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 912 posts
  • Location:delray biatch florida
  • Region:83
  • Car Year:1967
  • Car Number:67

:guinness:


Satire is primarily a literary genre or form, although in practice it can also be found in the graphic and performing arts. In satire, vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, and society itself, into improvement.[1] Although satire is usually meant to be funny, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit as a weapon.
SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America Survivalist - Won 25 Hours at Thunderhill! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other

#124
Andrew Charbonneau

Andrew Charbonneau

    Royal P.I.T.A.

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 912 posts
  • Location:delray biatch florida
  • Region:83
  • Car Year:1967
  • Car Number:67


Satire is primarily a literary genre or form, although in practice it can also be found in the graphic and performing arts. In satire, vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, and society itself, into improvement.[1] Although satire is usually meant to be funny, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit as a weapon.
SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America Survivalist - Won 25 Hours at Thunderhill! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other

#125
Andrew Charbonneau

Andrew Charbonneau

    Royal P.I.T.A.

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 912 posts
  • Location:delray biatch florida
  • Region:83
  • Car Year:1967
  • Car Number:67


Satire is primarily a literary genre or form, although in practice it can also be found in the graphic and performing arts. In satire, vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, and society itself, into improvement.[1] Although satire is usually meant to be funny, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit as a weapon.
SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America Survivalist - Won 25 Hours at Thunderhill! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other

#126
Craig Berry

Craig Berry

    Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 348 posts
  • Location:Dallas TX
  • Region:TX
  • Car Year:1999
  • Car Number:29
Andrew, as usual you are correct.....I did not have enough tape! IF YOUR NOT FIRST, YOUR LAST! Could not agree with you more buddy
Circuit of the Americas Winner - Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver BFG Supertour Winner - Majors Winner - Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+ We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations!

#127
wheel

wheel

    Veteran Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 800 posts
  • Location:Kansas City
  • Region:KC
  • Car Year:1992
  • Car Number:20

Todd,

I am just trying to let you all know that I doubt there is any sentiment to change this rule.  If there is a letter and the SMAC says they want to change the rule and the members input is in favor of a rule change, then, sure, the rule could change if a majority of the CRB votes to change it.  Given the discussion and input when this was discussed before, I doubt it would be changed.  Personally, I don't care either way. 

 

And, as a matter of fact I do not have sole or final call on any rules.   The CRB has seven other members and I only vote if there is a tie.  I think even you can do the math on that one.  ;-)



#128
FTodaro

FTodaro

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,084 posts
  • Location:Columbus Ohio
  • Region:Great Lakes
  • Car Year:2001
  • Car Number:35

Now that Mike fixed my download issue I can post a picture of exactly what i am talking about.

 

Wheel i know that there have been several letters written to the CRB requesting they revisit this rule. I obviously was not privy to the discussions about what the concerns were and why the rule was adopted. The only thing i have heard second hand is Aero.

 

I have asked they revisit this. I will add that if there is a concern about some type of competitive advantage I make two points:

 

Everyone has the same competitive advantage, so there is no advantage, anyone can decide to do it or not and therefore its really a matter of choice not an advantage.

 

If there is something i am missing about not wanting the taping to go two far, i am sure language could be drafted that would limit it to the face of the screen, or attached to the screen, and not the bumper or what ever would address the issue.

 

This is what i am talking about.

Attached Files

  • Attached File  tape.jpg   124.64KB   5 downloads

Frank
TnT Racing
SCCA Ohio Valley Region
 

Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+ We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Donor - Made PayPal donation

#129
wheel

wheel

    Veteran Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 800 posts
  • Location:Kansas City
  • Region:KC
  • Car Year:1992
  • Car Number:20

If you have an old letter number on the issue, I can do a trace and see what the discussion was.  I can't remember this coming through the CRB recently, but the volume of letters has been nuts, so I may just not remember it.  There are two request on the SMAC site on the issue, but it has not come to the CRB.

wheel



#130
FTodaro

FTodaro

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,084 posts
  • Location:Columbus Ohio
  • Region:Great Lakes
  • Car Year:2001
  • Car Number:35

If you have an old letter number on the issue, I can do a trace and see what the discussion was.  I can't remember this coming through the CRB recently, but the volume of letters has been nuts, so I may just not remember it.  There are two request on the SMAC site on the issue, but it has not come to the CRB.

wheel

On 2/20/15

I sent the following to the CRB site

 

http://www.crbscca.com/

 

 

 

_________________________________________________________________________

 

Propose to remove the requirement that tape only be applied to the radiator rather than the face of the screen mesh. There is no aero advantage and no reason to require tape on the radiator only. This requires significant dismantling of the cooling system and unnecessary risk of injury to avoid an unproven advantage of Aero.

 

The rule:

O. Cooling System

 

5. A radiator screen of 1/4 inch minimum mesh may be added in front of the radiator. The screen must be installed behind the front bumper cover and attached to the air guide. Tape and/or other materials may not be applied to the mesh or in the radiator opening in the bodywork. Tape or other materials may only be added directly to the radiator.


Frank
TnT Racing
SCCA Ohio Valley Region
 

Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+ We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Donor - Made PayPal donation

#131
wheel

wheel

    Veteran Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 800 posts
  • Location:Kansas City
  • Region:KC
  • Car Year:1992
  • Car Number:20

That letter will work its way through the system.  I'm not sure if the SMAC discussed it at their last meeting, as I was traveling to the convention and did not attend the meeting.  They will make a recommendation and send it up to the CRB in the near future.

wheel


  • FTodaro likes this

#132
davew

davew

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,297 posts
  • Location:Beloit, Wi
  • Region:Chicago
  • Car Year:1999
  • Car Number:72

I assume what you intend is

 

5. A radiator screen of 1/4 inch minimum mesh may be added in front of the radiator. The screen must be installed behind the front bumper cover and attached to the air guide. Tape and/or other materials may not be applied to the mesh or in the radiator opening in the bodywork. Tape or other materials may only be added directly to the radiator.

 

I would add:     ...air guide. Tape may be added to the screen to regulate air flow to the radiator. Tape or other products may not be added to the bumper cover.

 

If we are gonna rewrite this. Let's get it right the first time.

 

Dave


Dave Wheeler
Advanced Autosports, the nations most complete Spec Miata shop
Author, Spec Miata Constructors Guide, version 1 and 2.0

Building Championship winning cars since 1995

4 time Central Division Spec Miata Champion car builder 2012-2013-2014-2017

Back to Back June Sprints Spec Miata 1-2 finishes 2016 and 2017

5 time June Sprints winner in Mazda's

6 Time Northern Conference Champion Car Builder

2014 SCCA Majors National point Champion car builder

2014 SCCA Runoffs winner, T4 (Bender)

2014 Central Division Champion, ITS (Wheeler)

2013 Thunderhill 25 hour winning crew chief

2007 June Sprints winner, (GT1, Mohrhauser)

Over 200 race wins and counting.
www.advanced-autosports.com
dave@advanced-autosports.com
608-313-1230

Survive the 25, NASA Thunderhill - Survive the 25, NASA Thunderhill We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Sponsor / Advertiser - Site sponsor / advertiser... support these guys! Donor - Made PayPal donation Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver

#133
FTodaro

FTodaro

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,084 posts
  • Location:Columbus Ohio
  • Region:Great Lakes
  • Car Year:2001
  • Car Number:35

I assume what you intend is

 

5. A radiator screen of 1/4 inch minimum mesh may be added in front of the radiator. The screen must be installed behind the front bumper cover and attached to the air guide. Tape and/or other materials may not be applied to the mesh or in the radiator opening in the bodywork. Tape or other materials may only be added directly to the radiator.

 

I would add:     ...air guide. Tape may be added to the screen to regulate air flow to the radiator. Tape or other products may not be added to the bumper cover.

 

If we are gonna rewrite this. Let's get it right the first time.

 

Dave

Basically yes Dave, I was just quoting the current rule, but as a proposal it would be to strike that language. And agree we can limit the application of tape to the screen, no need to tape bumper, but we should craft it in such a way that we limit "the no bumper tape" to covering radiator, as some guys do tape over the fog light holes and i would assume that is permissible.


Frank
TnT Racing
SCCA Ohio Valley Region
 

Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+ We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Donor - Made PayPal donation

#134
38bfast

38bfast

    Veteran Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,113 posts
  • Location:Sterling Heights, MI
  • Region:OVR
  • Car Year:1999
  • Car Number:38
Those letters came in after our last meeting. It will go on next months agenda.
Ralph Provitz
V2 Motorsports

#135
LarryKing

LarryKing

    Veteran Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,659 posts
Thus grill tape becomes a tech item. Keeping it simple, keeping it fun.
2017 - SMSE SEDiv ECR Champion
Donor - Made PayPal donation Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver

#136
Jim Drago

Jim Drago

    East Street Racing / 2 Time National Champion

  • Administrators
  • 6,566 posts
  • Location:Memphis, Tn
  • Region:Mid South
  • Car Year:2005
  • Car Number:2

I assume what you intend is

 

5. A radiator screen of 1/4 inch minimum mesh may be added in front of the radiator. The screen must be installed behind the front bumper cover and attached to the air guide. Tape and/or other materials may not be applied to the mesh or in the radiator opening in the bodywork. Tape or other materials may only be added directly to the radiator.

 

I would add:     ...air guide. Tape may be added to the screen to regulate air flow to the radiator. Tape or other products may not be added to the bumper cover.

 

If we are gonna rewrite this. Let's get it right the first time.

 

Dave

It was rewritten once already.. While I dislike the rule as well, I don't think there is going to be any traction in getting it changed.  You(We) can run a Tstat or if we don't like we can continue to burn arms tapping radiator and make expensive flaps on the radiators etc. If there is even a hint that there is ANY advantage in doing it, I seriously doubt it will go anywhere. In short, you can get from A-C with out using B (tape). just harder top do,  So it is unlikely it will go anywhere

Jim


East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080

NASA Champs Winner - NASA Champs Winner Hoosier Super Tour points Champion - Hoosier Super Tour points Champion ARRC Champion - Won the ARRC Race in a Spec Miata Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata BFG Supertour Winner - Majors Winner - Circuit of the Americas Winner - We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America

#137
Jim Drago

Jim Drago

    East Street Racing / 2 Time National Champion

  • Administrators
  • 6,566 posts
  • Location:Memphis, Tn
  • Region:Mid South
  • Car Year:2005
  • Car Number:2

sorry craig you always had it but you were left out of the loop second place is ok first looser lol magic man  :rotfl:

I like this video selection better :) Grille tape working at its' finest :)


East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080

NASA Champs Winner - NASA Champs Winner Hoosier Super Tour points Champion - Hoosier Super Tour points Champion ARRC Champion - Won the ARRC Race in a Spec Miata Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata BFG Supertour Winner - Majors Winner - Circuit of the Americas Winner - We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America

#138
FTodaro

FTodaro

    Veteran Member

  • SMembers
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,084 posts
  • Location:Columbus Ohio
  • Region:Great Lakes
  • Car Year:2001
  • Car Number:35

It was rewritten once already.. While I dislike the rule as well, I don't think there is going to be any traction in getting it changed.  You(We) can run a Tstat or if we don't like we can continue to burn arms tapping radiator and make expensive flaps on the radiators etc. If there is even a hint that there is ANY advantage in doing it, I seriously doubt it will go anywhere. In short, you can get from A-C with out using B (tape). just harder top do,  So it is unlikely it will go anywhere

Jim

Jim

 

Who has proven there is an advantage? is it opinion or proof?

 

What is the advantage? if its open to all then its choice not advantage.

 

Maybe taping off the air inlet at the bumper face would be an areo advantage. but if your talking about restricting air inside the recessed air inlet (behind the bumper) you would have to show me the data, and if there is an advantage, it would just be noise.


Frank
TnT Racing
SCCA Ohio Valley Region
 

Make it Rain - Made Paypal donation of $100+ We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Donor - Made PayPal donation

#139
Jim Drago

Jim Drago

    East Street Racing / 2 Time National Champion

  • Administrators
  • 6,566 posts
  • Location:Memphis, Tn
  • Region:Mid South
  • Car Year:2005
  • Car Number:2

Jim

 

Who has proven there is an advantage? is it opinion or proof?

 

What is the advantage? if its open to all then its choice not advantage.

 

Maybe taping off the air inlet at the bumper face would be an areo advantage. but if your talking about restricting air inside the recessed air inlet (behind the bumper) you would have to show me the data, and if there is an advantage, it would just be noise.

Since when do you need to prove anything? I didn't say it was proven either :)

Plain and simply, it is a perceived advantage and the 1.6 guys don't seem to want to do it, so at best it adds more drama.  Stranger things have happened, but I will not be holding my breathe waiting on this change. 

Jim


East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080

NASA Champs Winner - NASA Champs Winner Hoosier Super Tour points Champion - Hoosier Super Tour points Champion ARRC Champion - Won the ARRC Race in a Spec Miata Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata BFG Supertour Winner - Majors Winner - Circuit of the Americas Winner - We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner June Sprints winner  - June Sprints winner SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America

#140
Andrew Charbonneau

Andrew Charbonneau

    Royal P.I.T.A.

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 912 posts
  • Location:delray biatch florida
  • Region:83
  • Car Year:1967
  • Car Number:67

I like this video selection better :) Grille tape working at its' finest :)

jesus how many hp was i really down lol


Satire is primarily a literary genre or form, although in practice it can also be found in the graphic and performing arts. In satire, vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, and society itself, into improvement.[1] Although satire is usually meant to be funny, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit as a weapon.
SCCA National Champion - Won SCCA Runoffs at Road America Survivalist - Won 25 Hours at Thunderhill! Bona fide - A bonafide Spec Miata driver Series Champ - Won a points based series in a Spec Miata We have a Winnah! - Won their 1st race... Congratulations! Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other Instigator - Made a topic or post that inspired other




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users