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1999 Pulling timing

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#21
High Chair

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I'm getting 23.5 at WOT according to the ECU.  Is 28-28.5 what the ECU is supposed to think, or do I add the 4-5 degrees of additional advance, in which case it looks about right now?

If you are reading the data from the ECU it will read 23.5. When you take it to the dyno have somebody stand outside with a timing light as you do a pull. You should see 28 or 28.5 total timing rock solid. If it is there is nothing wrong with the timing. However, while you are on the dyno make sure the butterflies snap open at roughly 5500. They should open and not float around. I have had the check valve go bad more than once and will certainly cause low TQ. 


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#22
fw87

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Both of my 99s do the exact same thing however there is nothing wrong with them. Solid at 15 and as soon as it reaches 180 F the timing is reduced by 8/10 degrees as it switches maps.  If you put the car on a dyno and check it at WOT you will see the total timing is rock solid at 28/28.5 right where it should be. You can change all of the parts you want but you will not get it to stop doing it. I actually changed everything in my car (everything including all wiring) and it still does it. That is when it was suggested to take it to the dyno. The car make the same HP/TQ as the rest and the timing is right where it should be under a load all the way to read line. I never looked for a resistor as Drago suggested and that might stop it but under power it makes no difference. By the way I had multiple engine people look at it and all said they had never seen anything like it. That includes Ti-Speed and Jeff over at Auto Technics yet I have two cars that do the exact same thing and both with new Ti-Speed engines

 

 

Is there a solution to this or is it not a big deal. With a OBD Scangauge mine does the same thing but the map switch happens at 175 F. Timing goes from 10 (ECU Timing) to 0 with a noticeable change in engine tone (at idle). At WOT timing is correct at 23 on OBD reader. 



#23
Mark

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I chased this problem on one of my cars for months. I never solved it and I still don't understand why this car pulled timing when others did not. Many hours and dollars spent to no avail. In the end the car ran like a beast and dynoed quite well so we just ran it. 


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#24
fw87

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I was able to chase this problem down to the neutral switch on the transmission. With the neutral switch not connected the computer stays in open loop at idle and causes the map change to 0* timing at 175.

 

Also fixed the low idle stumbling issues after a rev as I THINK the ICV only works when it knows the car is neutral?



#25
FTodaro

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I was able to chase this problem down to the neutral switch on the transmission. With the neutral switch not connected the computer stays in open loop at idle and causes the map change to 0* timing at 175.

 

Also fixed the low idle stumbling issues after a rev as I THINK the ICV only works when it knows the car is neutral?

Are you talking about the Big square switch on the top of the clutch pedal or the smaller one, mid pedal on the clutch? I had the hunt at low RPM problem and I cut that lower switch to solve it.


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#26
ChrisA

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I think the neutral switch is the one that sit on top of the transmission.

Chris

 

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#27
JNJ

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Put the car on jack stands, put it in gear, let the clutch out and check the timing.  If it is ok, it is not a problem you have to deal with.  I had this same issue and it was the connector for the jumper wire was open.  Smog test were done at idle when this car was designed, you have a lot of CO cushion if you retard the timing (only at idle in neutral or clutch in) at idle, when the test was done.  Ford got busted for running a different map while the hood was open at idle.  The timing (on a 1.6 verified and maybe the NB) doesn't retard below like 150 (I don't have my notes in front of me) it also runs normal time a few seconds after start up, then pulls it.  The jumper was used to stabilize idle speed and timing, if the circuit is not working you will have this issue.






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