95 replies to this topic

[Qyxz]

Hello all, total newbie here.  I've been doing HPDE for years, and finally went to racing school and got my provisional racing license.  I'm interested in getting into Spec Miata but my big question is: what is a realistic budget for each season?  

 

For the first year, I'm starting from scratch, so I'm guessing acquiring a car and trailer, getting some seat time at DE events, and several races to get a full regional license are what I'll be doing.  Not looking to be a front runner obviously, but would like a car that can run in the front 30% as I eventually develop the skills.  What can I expect?  $20k for the year? 

 

Since I'm looking for a prebuilt car (most cost-effective from what I've seen), what are things to look out for? After I acquire the car, what are the regular rebuilds/refreshes I should be doing?  I'm pretty mechanically inclined, although I draw the line at motor/trans/cage building. 

 

For the second year, I'd like to do many more races - is a budget of $10k reasonable?  

[Neil O]

Where are you located in New Jersey? If you are willing to do the MARRS season (lots of summit point, west virginia races) I would suggest SSM.  

 

Good Car $8000 - $10,000

Entry Fees $330 a weekend

Test Day $225

 

Get 4/32 Toyo RA-1 / last several weekends (just don't flat spot one) $800 for set of tires 

PFC pads last forever.  

 

Big Fields 40-50 cars 

[davew]

First one of these posts for the year.

 

Welcome to the madness.

 

First, do your due diligence. Read this forum and learn. Download the GCR for the club you will be running and read it, understand it. Buy my book, read it. You will appreciate the amount of user friendly knowledge in it. Be wary of the internet bargains. Often they are not as described, non compliant, badly damaged, poorly maintained, etc. Don't count on any of the "84 boxes of spare parts" to be worth anything. Used brake parts, bent suspension arms, etc are just scrap metal in a fancy bucket.

 

Be smart with your budget. A $6000 car that need $5000 worth of work is now worth $7000. Not a good investment. When a $12,000 car that needs no work is still worth $12k. My rule of thumb is that a decent car, good cage, reliable motor, current on the updates, current safety stuff should be $12-$15 race ready.

 

Have one of the SM experts inspect the car. Know what you are buying before you buy. Make friends with the local SM shop. You WILL need his help at some time.

 

Did I mention, read my book, understand the rules and read this forum (learn how to use the search function)

 

Welcome

Dave

[Tom Hampton]

In case you missed it above....Get Dave's book.

[Danny Steyn]

AND - if you buy a car at the track, take it home from the track .... too many of the go-fast parts can disappear if you allow it out of your sight!

[Bench Racer]

If your not up to speed with set-up use this site Downloads to find, Spec Miata Setup Guide 2.0
By Jim Daniels.

 

Ask any question you have, many folks on this site and all willing to share.

 

Dave, drum roll, what's your favorite response to this ^.  

[Johnny D]

Here you go DD. How do you pronounce Qyxz ??

[Diller]

Also look into renting cars from reputable shops. For the cost of a truck, trailer, and car, you can buy a LOT of racing from rentals. Most people sneak in to racing buy turning a road car into a race car and slowly piecing together the tow rig and trailer. If you are jumping in cold the rental rout is not a bad financial decision (in racing terms).

[Qyxz]

Thanks for the suggestions so far, they are very helpful.  I am in Northern NJ, I'm thinking of doing NE SCCA, they go to the tracks I like and I'm most familiar with.  I do plan on renting a car by year's end to do a couple DE events to get my feet wet, then purchasing over the winter. 

 

Big question - do any of you guys share a car?  I have a friend who also wants to get into this, but obviously there are a lot of logistics to figure out.  However, it may be a great way to amortize some costs...  Btw, are the costs in my original post realistic? 

[BNaumann]

As a newbie this year I just want to warn you that in my opinion there is nothing cheap about Spec Miata. Not gonna argue that, just my opinion.

Most people share a car by running SM and STL. Of course if your co-driver wrecks first...

[luvin_the_rings]

Some tips from the ultimate cheap skate: 

 

- You can find some spare tires outside the track tire shop toward the end of Saturday and Sunday race days.  If you're running bald tires, sometimes a fresher tire with a small flat spot is worth some time.  They usually give you the used tires for free or for like $10.  Mounting is also like $10 usually.  Its a great way to get some cheap seat time during a test day.  This also goes for random body panels, slightly used brake pads or wheel bearings.  Good thing about a spec class, is that the cars are very closely matched and the driver is usually the deciding factor, so you can learn alot from following a top guy with some slightly used tires or not ideal brakes/ wheel bearings.  

 

- Get to know your fellow SM racers.  SCCA and NASA racers are craving good competition, and new fresh blood to sacrifice.  They will help you get faster, and help you with car setup, so they can have a fun battle during the weekend.  Talk to them, ask them all your questions, but take it all with a grain of salt and fact-check their answers here on the forums and in Dave's book.  Had a guy offer to put his AIM solo in our car so he could compare our velocity graphs, and show us where were loosing the majority of our laptime.  Gained two seconds in two sessions after doing that.  Which leads me to my final point. 

 

- Get some sort of data acquisition.  Here is a link to some of the best systems for your buck: 

http://www.roadandtr...t-65-2-roa0913/

 

Their not that expensive, especially the ones that use your iPhone.  You don't NEED to log a whole bunch of stuff, Just tracking vehicle speed over the course of the lap can give you the majority of data you need to get a really good first cut at improving your times.  Steering angle, brake pressure and throttle position can be used to perfect your lap, but just the basic stuff can get you well into the mid-pack.  

 

Welcome, and good luck, 

 

-Z

[av8tor]

For the second year, I'd like to do many more races - is a budget of $10k reasonable?  

 

I race 1 weekend a month plus an occassional goof-off race like a FARA event or the Bracket Enduro. 

 

That ='s

entry - $400

tires - 900 (if you aren't really serious and don't want to qualify on stickers and race on stickers)

gas - 50

beer - 24

food - 25

ice - 20

oil change every 15 hours - 20 (that is half an oil change every weekend)

amortize consumables - 50

looks like about $1500 a weekend if I don't bring a mechanic and I sleep at the track.  Add an engine and 2 transmissions per year and that is another $7000.  So race 12 weekends a year and sleep in your trailer, you are looking at $25,000 per year.  Doesn't include body damage, windshields, bumper covers, broken trailers, radios, safety equipment, set up equipment or beer while setting up the car for the next race.  Am I missing anything?  It's a lot cheaper than unlimited hydroplanes, off shore fishing, or being married.

[Jeff Wasilko]

If you're going thru two transmissions per year, you're doing it wrong. Same with an engine per year.

 

I just had a failure in a rebuilt transmission that had 3 years (4900 track miles and 114 hours on it). The engine has more hours/miles on it.

 

Mazda stuff is pretty reliable and stands up well to the abuse we give.

[callumhay]

I think it's difficult to know if your 20 k is realistic because a lot depends on what you want and what you are willing to compromise. When starting out with that kind of budget you can be car- rich and race poor. Meaning buy a 15-16 k car (1999-2000+) and not race much. Or car poor and race rich as in a 5-6 k 1990-1993 and maybe a 1994-1997 car and race more. If you want to know how good a driver you are, as Danny said, buy the car after it clears impound at the race.... With cash , take it home and then go chase the seller's time.. I'm sure others will chime in but it will likely cost more than 20 k. I started in an NA and just getting out there is a blast and I have learned a lot. I also believe if you race it you have to be willing to replace it , if you have the misfortune of wrecking the thing.
As others have said here, SM is deceivingly expensive. It's incredibly competitive, popular and it takes a lot of $200 here and $500 there to put a good car together.

I would not share a car in SM (unless it was with a son/daughter) That's just my personal preference. Too much possibility of things going south when one person thinks they are doing more, wrecks or has different priorities. If the goal is to save money, go for a 1.6 and have fun.

In terms of finding a car, I frequently see miatas on my scca region monthly publication. Finding a local car that is sitting because of lack of interest may be a good thing. If you are willing to go the ITA route you may be able to get a good miata for less than a comparable SM. You can have fun with that too and if you want to race SM with it you can always waive finishing position. And if you truly have the bug can progressively make the car SM compliant.
In terms of tow vehicle , do u have one that can tow a miata in an enclosed or open trailer? If your track is close could you drive there in a street legal race car with a little trailer behind with your tires? Saves a lot of money but getting a street legal race miata is a challenge. Most don't come with titles (presumably because no one cared to pay the fees to transfer it) and the exhaust, lights or lack thereof may or may not be legal...
I think it's fair to say that you will likely burn 20 k pretty quickly. There was a thread on here about building a competitive miata for under 15 k. If you do move forward maybe you could start one with the best way to make 20k go the farthest and have the most amount of fun. To me that's a trophy all day long. (Not that building your own car for under 20k isn't bad either.!)
Good luck.
Cal

[B(Kuch)Kucera45]

I like what Cal said.

I started with a street car and installed a cage and started racing and from there I added 1 or 2 go fast items a year . I built my own car and motor and have been running it for 3 years without any issues ( knock on wood). But with the low cost of the NA's it's kind of a no brainier.

I would say go and rent one of each gen and decide which car suits you best. The NA is a on the edge kind of car that has to be driven with very few mistakes to be competitive ( but it's a total blast). The 94-97 are a little better as far as handling then the NA but very similar to each other. The NB has more TQ compaired to the older two gens but also carry more weight and are not as nimble as them ( more forgiving).

IMHO I would rent one of each before you buy one this way you will be totally happy with your choice and won't regret it. It doesn't matter what year you pick because you will have a blast in any of them and will always have plenty of competition in any race you enter in. This is by far the most competitive and most fun class to be in IMHO !

Welcome and hope to see you at the track one day.

[Qyxz]

This idea of buying a car at the track is interesting.  Having it pass race scrutineering is pretty enticing, since I won't really know what is spec right now.  Is it common that people sell cars at races?  What do I do, just show up to the next event at my local track day and see if anyone has something for sale? 

 

Are tires really 900 bucks an event? A quick search shows I can get a full set for around $700.  Surely they are good for more than 1 event if I'm just looking to be midpack in my first couple years?  

 

What are the major differences between a Miata built for ITA and a SM? From what I see under a quick search, there is less restrictions for power, which I would think makes it more expensive, but most listings are less than that of SM. 

[chris haldeman]

likely you could race on 10k a year. 3-5 times that too be competitive in an Scca majors setting. Ssm is a great option for cost containment and great racing for low costs. As for tire costs and usefulness if you are planning too run Hoosiers in the Scca and are looking too be competitive it will be 1-2 new sets per weekend at most tracks. It really boils down too weather or not you are willing too just have fun and do the best you can and be happy with that or if you need too win.

[Johnny D]

You have a lot to learn, ask away, use the search box up top.

SM can run in ITA for a second run group and has open tire rule (ITA), but a Built ITA Miata is not SM legal and can run faster times.
This is regional, there's Majors or National STL, classes.

Check what clubs you have in region MARRS, NASA, SCCA, what classes, SM, SSM, ITA, whatever, they have there own tires per class, Hoosier, Toyo, open.

Toyo RA-1 and RR's are a very good value, sometime cording at there fastest, some shave RA-1's.

In my region there's not any cars for sale unless you contact them a head of time and there really looking to sell it at an event.
Asking us if we know the car would help too so you don't get a lemon.

Just my opinion.
J~

[callumhay]

An ITA is likely to have engine modifications making it ineligible for SM. Ride height also slightly higher and intake and exhaust modifications also likely, again making ineligible for SM. It's also a regional only class...but probably no big deal if you are starting out. If you were to take an ITA car into a SM group you sure would want to be respectful of the other drivers and check with the stewards too. I think if the goal is to have fun and learn then it may be OK, but again you would want to waive finishing position.

I don't think you need tires every weekend if you are a mid packer and having fun. Maybe every 3-4 weekends.

I think it's fair to say that the premium to buy a car at the track, especially a race winner could be high..and well north of 20k. It helps to have been at the track a few times to begin to learn who is who.

That being said I have seen cars go up for sale at the track..and the for sale sign come down once the frustration settled down!

[FTodaro]

For the second year, I'd like to do many more races - is a budget of $10k reasonable?  

 

I race 1 weekend a month plus an occassional goof-off race like a FARA event or the Bracket Enduro. 

 

That ='s

entry - $400

tires - 900 (if you aren't really serious and don't want to qualify on stickers and race on stickers)

gas - 50

beer - 24

food - 25

ice - 20

oil change every 15 hours - 20 (that is half an oil change every weekend)

amortize consumables - 50

looks like about $1500 a weekend if I don't bring a mechanic and I sleep at the track.  Add an engine and 2 transmissions per year and that is another $7000.  So race 12 weekends a year and sleep in your trailer, you are looking at $25,000 per year.  Doesn't include body damage, windshields, bumper covers, broken trailers, radios, safety equipment, set up equipment or beer while setting up the car for the next race.  Am I missing anything?  It's a lot cheaper than unlimited hydroplanes, off shore fishing, or being married.

YOUR beer budget is really low. IMO.

 

While club racing rates up there with any other hobby in terms of cost. Its cheaper than a mistress.