38 replies to this topic

[Jim Drago]

The CRB is aware of the concerns of Spec Miata owners about availability of the Toyo Proxes RA1 tires that are required for National racing. Due to conditions at their Japanese production facilities, Toyo is unable to tell us when these tires will be back in production and readily available in the United States. As a result, the CRB will make a decision about Spec Miata tires as more information is available. If there is not an adequate supply of RA1s, there will be a TEMPORARY change of the specification to permit the use of the Toyo Proxes R888s in addition to the RA1s. Toyo reports that there is a sufficient supply of the R888s. However, only ONE tire will be permitted at the Runoffs. If an adequate supply of the RA1s is not available before the Runoffs, then ONLY the R888s would be permitted. For now, the RA1 remains the required tire.

[Tom Sager]

Appreciate the update. While not an ideal situation, going back to the 888 temporarily is not a bad option IMO. There is familiarity with the tire and after a full season of using 888's that tire didn't seem as troublesome as it did initially.

[dmathias]

Indiana rarely sees tsunamis. Jus say'in.

[Lee Tilton]

However, only ONE tire will be permitted at the Runoffs. If an adequate supply of the RA1s is not available before the Runoffs, then ONLY the R888s would be permitted.

So all the teams that scrambled to find RA1s after it appeared they would be in short supply, would be penalized by having to buy even more tires?

[wheel]

The discussion centered around making the best out of a bad situation. Changing manufacturers in the middle of the season just wouldn't work. The racers in the SE division, for example, have already run most of their races. They would have to do expensive testing to adjust for a brand new tire. Almost everyone has run the 888 and there shouldn't be too much trouble moving back to that tire, if the RA1 supply dries up. At any rate, we hope the RA1 is available and this will all become unnecessary, but that's out of our hands.

wheel

[Jim Drago]

So all the teams that scrambled to find RA1s after it appeared they would be in short supply, would be penalized by having to buy even more tires?

The statement and decision was made trying to consider all factors, hoarding of tires was a concern and something we wanted to prevent.
Jim

[wheel]

So, yes, if somebody attempted to hoard the RA1 tires, they may end up having to buy some 888s in the future. No advantage to anyone.

[pat slattery]

Lets try to keep the RA1's, those tires will last a long time, some will just have to get by without putting on two new sets on a race day.

That R88 sucks on a 1.6 car.

Lets go to Hoosiers if we are forced to make a change

[High Chair]

After what the people of Japan have gone through I have no problem running the 888 for the rest of the year if needed. I don't like the 888 but in the end it would not be the end of the world if my Spec Miata had tires I didn't like while I spent my day racing around with friends and drinking beer. Hell, they can't even feed themselves so I think our problems are very small!!

[dstevens]

Well said High Chair. SM is fortunate as it's a 15" tire. I understand the 18" R888s are going and almost gone. The American Iron guys had to change manufacturers. Looks like they are making an agreement to use the Hoosier R-6. I wonder how difficult it would be to tool the Toyo plant in GA to make race tires.

[Keith Novak]

I wonder how difficult it would be to tool the Toyo plant in GA to make race tires.

It’s probably not quick and easy. They’d need the floor space, the tooling set up and calibrated, sort out the supply chain logistics, people to work the machines…enough tricky details that niche market tires probably aren’t their #1 priority right now.

A number of companies are finding out that their lean production systems might be highly efficient when everything is running smoothly, run into some serious issues when the defecation hits the oscillation.

[fishguyaz]

Lets try to keep the RA1's, those tires will last a long time, some will just have to get by without putting on two new sets on a race day.

That R88 sucks on a 1.6 car.

Lets go to Hoosiers if we are forced to make a change

the R888 was the spec tire when i raced my spec 944 in AZ. those things were good for the 1st/2nd session, then they dropped off a lot on grip and sucked for the rest of their existance.

I bet they have lots of the 888 still in inventory, they stink, and IMO, nobody would buy them if given a choice of something else.
I have heard great things about the hoosier SM6, but have never used them myself.

[Juan Pineda]

Yea for 888's!

-Juan

[FTodaro]

The statement and decision was made trying to consider all factors, hoarding of tires was a concern and something we wanted to prevent.
Jim

Jim any discussion about the Nitto NT-01. i am told its made of the same compound as the RA-1 just a different tread pattern. Don't know if that is true. I have Ran the NT-01 can't say head to head comparison but it was not as bad as the 888.

[Qik Nip]

I understand the 18" R888s are going and almost gone. The American Iron guys had to change manufacturers. Looks like they are making an agreement to use the Hoosier R-6.

Bet that's just breaking thier hearts (NOT)
Rick

[Little Bill]

While I respect wanting to honor the contract, the contract was for the RA-1 not the 888. There are better tire options out there if the RA-1 supply dries up. The 888 is not the best option, and I gave to the American Red Cross, for tsunami relief…it’s also a write off, which purchasing multiple sets of 888’s will not be.

What happens when the supply of 888’s dries up?? Going to the 888 as a backup makes no sense, they fall off quickly which means we need to buy more tires to keep on track performance at maximum. If I am going to have to spend money on tires lets make sure it is money spent on a product that the manufacturer can keep in stock.

Won’t be fun come runoffs time to be testing Hoosiers, Nitto’s, or some other tire because there is no supply of RA-1’s or 888 available.

I recognize that Japan and its people are in a world of hurt right now. I had the option to help financially and I did through the Red Cross, and I am happy that I did. However, forcing me to have to use an inferior product if the supply of RA-1’s dries up; when there is no guarantee that the 888 will remain available, in order to help out Toyo makes no sense to me.

[pat slattery]

While I respect wanting to honor the contract, the contract was for the RA-1 not the 888. There are better tire options out there if the RA-1 supply dries up. The 888 is not the best option, and I gave to the American Red Cross, for tsunami relief…it’s also a write off, which purchasing multiple sets of 888’s will not be.

What happens when the supply of 888’s dries up?? Going to the 888 as a backup makes no sense, they fall off quickly which means we need to buy more tires to keep on track performance at maximum. If I am going to have to spend money on tires lets make sure it is money spent on a product that the manufacturer can keep in stock.

Won’t be fun come runoffs time to be testing Hoosiers, Nitto’s, or some other tire because there is no supply of RA-1’s or 888 available.

I recognize that Japan and its people are in a world of hurt right now. I had the option to help financially and I did through the Red Cross, and I am happy that I did. However, forcing me to have to use an inferior product if the supply of RA-1’s dries up; when there is no guarantee that the 888 will remain available, in order to help out Toyo makes no sense to me.

+1

Pat

[Bruce Wilson]

888s was the most logical decision.

Thanks Jim.

-bw

[wheel]

Nothing was done to "help out Toyo". Nothing like that ever even entered the debate about what to do, in the event that the RA1s were not available. Yes, there are tires that are better than the 888. But that, again, is not the point. Toyo has said that there are plenty of 888 tires available in the SM size. This would make the 888 the natural choice to replace the RA1s, if that supply dries up. Most everyone has driven the 888, with the exception of drivers new to the class this season. Since changing manufacturers would be completely unfair to the racers who have finish most, or all, of their season, how could you justify throwing a totally different tire into the mix? If your season is just beginning, great for you, and nice try. Go buy those Hoosiers and get out there and set up your car. The guys in Florida will have to change their whole program to have a chance against you. We are not going to let that happen, unless all of the RA1s and all of the 888s disappear. Now, the discussion of what tires are best for future seasons after the current contract expires, that is another topic, entirely.

wheel

[dstevens]

Now, the discussion of what tires are best for future seasons after the current contract expires, that is another topic, entirely.

Is the contract season to season? There is a likely chance they aren't going to be back to capacity for about a year unless they move production to another plant. I doubt Toyo will be able to supply adequately supply the US hobby racing series. Rather than waiting until Dec or Jan to make the call, I think it prudent that by Sept they need enough of a vision going forward that someone else is picked at least for the 2012 season.