280 replies to this topic

[Muda]

10 of those guys were at Thunderbolt a couple of weeks ago.

Which scrutineer missed that headlight air intake? Can't get much more blatant than that.

[Scott McKay]

Derik:

As your publicist, I will tell you this. You're a cheating piece of s. I knew it the minute you passed me. If you pass me, you must be cheating, because I'm cheating.

[Ron Alan]

In case you missed it the Ernie show is on a different thread. However he is disingenious about his exhaust. The other guy that was found to be non-compliant was a newbie who just bought the race car. He is still responible for his car but we all know that those kind of things can happen. It's not the same as putting your car together yourself knowing that the car was illegal. I have no doubt that his car will be compliant at the next race.



But here you go some info about the car. Last race at Sebring Jr was complaining the car was down a little on power at the higher rpm but he still won the race. We decided to go over the engine last week with new rings bearings etc. We also ordered a cylinder head from Gilfus Racing which came in Tuesday and put the engine together then on the dyno for 1hr. This was the first run for the car with the new engine to break it in. We did do the sniffer test and was at 9.1 which is low. Saturday I was on the phone with Gilfus Racing trying to find out what the problem was and if it was from the rings not fully seated or him not taking enough off the head. Even down on power he was able to place 6th with no draft partner. His times were about 1.2 seconds off the pace. He did get faster as he put more time on the engine. That was enough to put him just behind the front runners.

Oh if this is about a header that was not ported but missing 2 nubs in the exhaust port and otherwise normal. We changed it for them right away and wanted to that Patrick for pointing out the problem. You want to talk about porting the car next to us at tech had a fully ported header. We grabbed that header from a pile we had and stuck it on the car. Obviously it made no power since it was on for practice only and we changed it for qualifying and went faster. Not as bad as 5 out of the 8 cars racing in grand am not passing tech in practice.

SM is only a stepping stone for Jr. He is already set to race World Challenge and maybe grand Am next year. You know what I love about that is no one can touch the engines so it will be all about the drivers.

Jr is moving up to WC in B-Spec then ST. the team is also thinking about sticking him in a Corvette at the end of Next Year. SM is just a stepping stone for one year and that is it. His sponsor has him doing motivational speeches at a number of schools and appearances in on both TV and radio.
Ernie Francis

WOW...this guys head is so deep in the sand OPEC is going to be tapping his arss soon. Was he born in Hawaii or Kenya?

Danny hits the nail on the head with "wisdom". Though I absolutely agree with Alex on the lack of responsibility many of our youth are growing up with in todays society, the majority of the time it would be unjust to lay the burden at the feet of our teenagers. Not necessarily giving them a pass...just pointing out is it fair when 9 times out of 10 it's monkey see monkey do?(BTW...in matters like this) As the mentors and adults we have the future in our hands with the next generation. Jr. will come out of this a "wiser" young man...but still a child and will be labeled...thanks dad I hope he drops the age when he turns 15!

[Jim Drago]

Danny hits the nail on the head with "wisdom". Though I absolutely agree with Alex on the lack of responsibility many of our youth are growing up with in todays society, the majority of the time it would be unjust to lay the burden at the feet of our teenagers. Not necessarily giving them a pass...just pointing out is it fair when 9 times out of 10 it's monkey see monkey do?(BTW...in matters like this) As the mentors and adults we have the future in our hands with the next generation. Jr. will come out of this a "wiser" young man...but still a child and will be labeled...thanks dad I hope he drops the age when he turns 15!

That sums up my feelings as well

[latapx]

Glenn,

Nice video. I feel bad for the kid. What's the deal with the driver's side headlight assembly? Not a too subtle attempt to get cold air to the intake...

10 of those guys were at Thunderbolt a couple of weeks ago.

Which scrutineer missed that headlight air intake? Can't get much more blatant than that.

The video for that special was recorded at a FARA event. Classes there are by engine size. MP-4B is a class for 1.6L and smaller engined cars as well as 1.8 SM running per SM rules. The 1.6L Miata can run unrestricted which is why you see the headlight bucket. They swap parts back and forth on that car depending on whether its NASA/FARA, etc. Not trying to defend anyone...just stating facts...and that headlight bucket was NOT in place at the NASA event.

[LarryKing]

I think Mr. Francis is doing a fine job raising his son, without everyone's unsolicited advice, as evidenced by the WSVN feature - Very cool Junior!

Not trying to defend anyone...just stating facts...and that headlight bucket was NOT in place at the NASA event.

Let's not muddy-up the character assasinations with facts, shall we.

[Zauskycop]

I think Mr. Francis is doing a fine job raising his son, without everyone's unsolicited advice, as evidenced by the WSVN feature - Very cool Junior!



Let's not muddy-up the character assasinations with facts, shall we.

We aren't doing the assasinating....we are just looking over the bullet wound

[Jim Platis]

I am a cheater.

That was hard to type and even harder to imagine being the case before last Saturday. As a recent addition to the SM community, this is not what I had in mind for my coming out party. My car was the other car found to be non compliant during the initial tear down at the NASA FL event on Saturday. I will be the first to acknowledge that I am the one responsible for what is inside the car. I deserved to get DQ'ed for having a header that was blantantly massaged on the inside. That being said, I would have bet a significant amount of money just prior to removing the header that I was 100% legal. It is a new car to me and based on it's history I didn't think there would be any issues. Live and learn. I sincerly appreciate the effort that NASA FL put into the compliance testing this past weekend. I would much rather take the cheating beatdown at a local race among friends then six months down the road when I have much more time and money invested into a platform that I thought was good to go. Other than the whole cheating issue, it was a great weekend. Lots of drama and opportunities for emotional releases both good and bad. It was nice to get some crossover with the SCCA guys and get a feel for how far I need to go to be competitive. As someone relatively new to racing I've got no complaints about how i or anyone else was treated this weekend. The tech guys were extraordinarliy fair and helpful in helping me through this unpleasant event. Thanks to everyone who helped me get back on track after addressing my issues. (only one of which was cheater related)

I think John Edwards and I must both use Scott McKay as our public relations guy.

derik

Dude,



I always new you were a cheater. How else could you have beaten me all these years? The best part was you with a wrench in your hand I should have taken a picture.

[Jim Platis]

You did a great job this weekend and there is no doubt that you're going to continue to improve with both car prep and seat time. Your reaction and response to the technical infraction is exactly what many of us (Charb/Jamie/Myself and others) were hoping to hear from Breathless. Instead, we were all told to fudge off, threatened, and insulted because we questioned their legality.

See you at Sebring!

Alex,

You keep this up his head will get so big he will not be able to get in the car.

[Jim Platis]

sorry to tell you the francis crew no factor your in trouble when i come to mid ohio

by the way you bet on the wrong horsey lol

Andrew,

Nice meeting you this weekend, good time for everyone, NASA did a great job with tech I think it was needed desperatly. We should get together for a few beers with my brother some time.

[tburas56]

I think Mr. Francis is doing a fine job raising his son, without everyone's unsolicited advice, as evidenced by the WSVN feature - Very cool Junior!

Let's not muddy-up the character assasinations with facts, shall we.

How is defending or playing stupid to cheating not mudding up anyones character?
I agree the video was very cool, but what happens if he was caught cheating that weekend? What would the producer do then?

[Caveman-kwebb99]

I agree the video was very cool, but what happens if he was caught cheating that weekend? What would the producer do then?

What all tv producers do, wing it with something else, or flip the script and report that right after the interview he was disqualified for a tech infraction.

[Caveman-kwebb99]

How is defending or playing stupid to cheating not mudding up anyones character?
I agree the video was very cool, but what happens if he was caught cheating that weekend? What would the producer do then?

It doesnt matter what all of us say the poster you replied to is a contrarian. if we say sky is blue he wil say it green, thats just the way it is... so dont waist your breath.

[LarryKing]

Shame on me for thinking that discussions about compliance should not include personal attacks, like calling someone a bad father, or questioning the paternity of his son.

And shame on me for believing that a young man whose parent is dealing with a life-threatening illness should receive a little compassion.

My bad.

[Caveman-kwebb99]

Just for the record Jr.'s mother has been in my prayers, I for one have never personally attacked them, some have but some have also been provoked.

Some said from the start the Kid was innocent till proven guilty... Its proved and yet those same people now want to give him a free pass...

Ask yourself, would you give Drago, Charbs, Berry, Steyn, Burras, others I am forgetting, EVEN MYSELF a free pass if we had a sick family member? I dont think you would... I think there would be glee in catching us even if our wives were on their death beds. When Chip was being called "Cheater Chip" a few weeks ago, where was your sensativity then, He has been battling Cancer, yet nobody called for Papa Speechless racing to give Chip a break or ease up on the accusations..

Your missing the point that several have PM'd Sr. to ask him to just make the car right, to no avail. He made his own bed now he must lay in it... Many of us have openly wished his wife and his family well on the personal side fo things, I am sure some public msg and others via PM. Nobody wishes ill on that family and we all want her to win her battle!

The goal is still just to have Sr. Admit guilt and rectify... Is that really so hard? Is that really so unfair? Is that really a personal attack? Does that have any bearing on our wishes for Mrs. Francis health?

I for one never condoned or intended any attack on him as a father, husband, or otherwise. I do think as a role model there is work to be done... And as a fellow competitor a Very simple 2 words is all it takes for this thread to end...

I'm Sorry?????????????????????????

[Keith Novak]

Jr. seems like a nice kid and a victim caught in the crossfire. You can’t even fault him for his press releases. Publicity sure doesn’t hurt if you want to expand your program or go on to the next level. If he got help or they were ghostwritten by someone else, who cares.

Sr.’s comments and lengthy defense here before the event, and then the lack of any real response after DQ isn’t helping promote his son. It’s like a televangelist who was shouting about virtue vs. sin from the pulpit, then gets caught with a hooker. His response, “Big deal. It’s not like it was a transsexual hooker, and BTW we don’t care about this class. You’re all just little people and we’re just here until we move on to bigger things.” That looks bad from a number of angles.

[Caveman-kwebb99]

Jr. seems like a nice kid and a victim caught in the crossfire. You can’t even fault him for his press releases. Publicity sure doesn’t hurt if you want to expand your program or go on to the next level. If he got help or they were ghostwritten by someone else, who cares.

Sr.’s comments and lengthy defense here before the event, and then the lack of any real response after DQ isn’t helping promote his son. It’s like a televangelist who was shouting about virtue vs. sin from the pulpit, then gets caught with a hooker. His response, “Big deal. It’s not like it was a transsexual hooker, and BTW we don’t care about this class. You’re all just little people and we’re just here until we move on to bigger things.” That looks bad from a number of angles.

And I am sure makes all of those Grand Am teams racing over to line up to sign a contract with the Prodigy knowing that their Sponsors can expect this very same kind of Top Notch representation, and responsibility...

[FTodaro]

M&S I think people have been for the most part trying to give Jr the benefit of the doubt, and the attacks on Sr. are not about him being a Bad Father per se but, the fact that he has done little to own up to a now vary public incident.

"If you can't take the heat get out of the kitchen" the saying goes. Jr and Sr have put them selves in the kitchen so to speak by pointing out there success vs other competitors on this forum. In effect have held themselves out to a high standard. For that you have to answer to the the forum for your conduct if its not legit. I understand your compassion for EF, Sr's circumstances, but for the most part this was brought on my his conduct not the forum.

I am sure in other circles EF Sr is a nice guy, has to have had something going to be successful, but this is a black eye, If I ever compete against him again, it would always be in the back of my mind if this is a fair fight or just me vs. the unknown.

It sure has had high entertainment value though. I also think it has served as notice of how your fellow competitors feel about you if you cheat. Maybe folks will start to get it that there is a fine line between competitive advantage, and cheating, and you better not cross it.

[LarryKing]

I would like to see a list of all SM compliance violations for the past 10 years. I bet some of the biggest finger pointers would be on that list.

[Rob Burgoon]

And I am sure makes all of those Grand Am teams racing over to line up to sign a contract with the Prodigy knowing that their Sponsors can expect this very same kind of Top Notch representation, and responsibility...

Thing is, I'm not sure they will know. Cheating up a storm to have a successful year in SM was probably the plan. I imagine being able to cite wins in the SM year gives you cred with the pros and better deals when you buy your rides since people will think you can drive extremely well. Unless the team is able to find out about the cheating, they may never know about Ernie Francis Jr.'s cheating escapades. Even if they do, is the downside all that bad?

The Francis familiy is exploiting our class. Only thing to do is throw paper until they manage to show up with an honest car if they are capable of that. That, or call any pro teams you know and fill them in. It's a small racing world.