61 replies to this topic

[Danica Davison]

Todd, i think you bring up a good point but I would like to go into it...I was still 2 seconds off danny's and selin's best lap time in the second race which is fair from a high level view.  All three of us ran our best lap times on lap 3.  I know we are comparing two different races with two different depths of talent and two different conditions, etc.  I hate to throw in more variables, and I don't want to toot my own horn, because I know I still have a lot of work to do, but it sounds like you want more detail. 

 

 Danny was on stickers and I think Selin might have been to, (Danny, please correct me if I am wrong).  Myself, a long with cory, jeff, nick, charbs, were all on old tires.  Shit...I haven't even been on stickers, I think I was maybe on 7-8 heat cycles?   Danny and selin checked out and ran together the whole time I think.  On lap 3, they both ran 2:35.5's and I am guessing were working together.  My best lap was 2:37:8 in P16.  I will have to look at my video to see if I was battling for position, by myself, if i had help or not, or whatever the case was.  Excluding danny and selin, the other front runners times were:

P3 - P11

Collum (99): 2:37.1

Charbs (99): 2:37.4

Malatesta (97): 2:37.8

Andrews (99?): 2:37.7

Joey G (01?): 2:38.1

Buras (94): 2:38.1

Pardus (99): 2:37.7

Davison (99): 2:37.8

Connole (02):  2:39.7

 

Idk how selin and danny went that much faster than cory and a couple of those other guys, cause they were all just as fast in the last race...but I was within 0.7 of cory in 3rd, and in STL I hung right there with Charbonneau.

 

The average times of the front runners at the majors earlier this year were running 35', 36's, 37's in the race... as I was running 2:41's in my 1.6.  So do I think they are at least somewhat comparable races?  I would think so.  I didn't mean to turn this into a parity thing, but just was expressing how I felt about switching to the 99 and the difference it made for me personally.  For me personally, here are my thoughts...

 

1. I think the 99 was way easier to drive, it handled almost flawlessly and was much more consistent throughout the race. 

2. Running in traffic.  When I was in the 1.6, if I was around a faster 99+ with a slower driver...it killed me.  Going much slower through corners, no torque coming out, etc. 

3. Mistakes. The 99 was more forgiving because if I made a mistake, which trust me..i made a few...I could get back on the power and still be able to recover.  Even a small mistake in the 1.6, I would lose the car in front of me and get passed by other cars behind me because I lost momentum.   

 

The sebring majors will definitely show us if my thinking holds true. I guess we will wait and see. 

[Danny Steyn]

Some info on my times

 

In Race 1 I had the privilege of being pushed through the turns and down the ENTIRE straight by Selin Rollan. Together we ran 1.5 seconds faster than anyone else and about 2 seconds faster than I had gone in Qually or Test day. I was on stickers for Race 1.

 

Used the same set of tires for Race 2. Here Cory and others inserted themselves between Selin and I and were were never able to team up. so our lap times were over 1 second slower. But pretty happy with the SM7 and my tire management strategy as I was able to run my fastest lap on the last lap of a 30 minute race. It appeared as if Cory's tires went off early, and I was able to hang without overheating the tires.

[Danny Steyn]

NOW THIS IS FUN - Here is Race 2 which was way more fun than Race 1. As you will see I was dealing with a gearbox with bent selector fork that made it difficult........ Watch full frame in HD - ENJOY

 

[LarryKing]

 

P3 - P11

Collum (99): 2:37.1

Charbs (99): 2:37.4

Malatesta (97): 2:37.8

Andrews (99?): 2:37.7

Joey G (01?): 2:38.1

Buras (94): 2:38.1

Pardus (99): 2:37.7

Davison (99): 2:37.8

Connole (02): 2:39.7

 

These cars/drivers are 2 - 2.5 sec off the leader's pace. You can't seriously consider them top drivers in top cars can you?

[Pat Ross]

I think that John Davison's experience driving his new '99 as compared with his NA1.6 reinforces what MPR22 has contended all along: The NB is easier to drive fast and is more consistent. 

 

What we also need to consider is that John's NA1.6 is a race car with many races under its belt.  The '99 is new.  The wear and tear of many races takes its toll on these "girl cars", especially with the beating some of them get.  If you will note, the front runners usually replace their NBs with a new one every year or at the least every other year.  Why?  Just because they like to spend money?  Wrong.

 

Pat

[LarryKing]

 

How MANY times have we been told that switching from NA to NB will not suddenly make someone faster, and even that they may be slower at first as they adjust?

 

We may wish to file that under theory, or maybe half-assed opinions. Not fact.

[Jim Drago]

Move all further parity discussions to a parity thread or start yet another.. the rest here will be deleted.

[LarryKing]

We're sorry dad. (John started it)

[Danica Davison]

That is interesting Walter...you say that list didn't have "top drivers in top cars"? 

 

One national champion

Two of those guys qualified top 5 in the 2015 runoffs.. with another just outside of top 5.

Two of those guys finished top 5 in the 2015 runoffs... Care to change your opinion?

 

Jim Drago, I did not intend for this to spin off in a parity thread, nor did I want it to as I believe it wasn't the place for it.  I didn't "start" anything.  Danny gave his race recap of his race and I gave the recap one of the race not too far behind him.  Didn't know Danny was the only guy on the track...The point I was intending to make was to say that I had a blast in my new 99 racing with guys and gals I have never even been close to before.  It made me happy just to be around those drivers and to even "keep up" with some of these drivers that I respect greatly and look up to.  Like Danny said, I have no more excuses which was the exact reason of moving to the 99 for me.  I know I am not the best driver, but I wouldn't say I am a poor one either.  Steve asked a simple question of the prep difference which Jamie answered accurately for me.  And then everyone else on this thread spun it into a parity issue, to which I added my input of my experience in the new car.  I give out a lot of shit, and I can take it back...but in my opinion, some reactions to this are pretty pathetic. 

 

So I will say again, I look forward to the majors and hope to be even closer than I was this weekend.  

[Steve Scheifler]

John, I think you missed Walter's dripping sarcasm. He was going for a parody of the frequent comments that there is no "good" data on 1.6's these days because there are no well prepped cars being driven by 'top" drivers. That's actually an unfortunate truth in most regions but I still found his quip hilarious.

[Danica Davison]

Ahh... I see that now .  Oh well my apologies to walter then...I can't win them all   

[Jim Drago]

John no issues with your post at all... And Walters last post was funny as hell
And more importantly congrats on a nice run and nice job with the new car.

[Danny Steyn]

Internet and Sarcasm ...... an often misunderstood relationship!

[LarryKing]

Picking nits: in the interest of accuracy this post should be titled 57 SMs, 11 SMSEs and 1 WSMSE.

 

(Is there a sarcasm emoji?)

[Brandon]

...I don't like to complain a lot but it is very frustrating when you are running 1-2 seconds a lap faster than the jumper and have to fight to get back around.  But, that's part of racing I guess. 
 

 

This here is the problem we as a class have with our competitors.  If you have proof (video goes a long way) of someone stepping out and jumping the start, throw paper!  Regardless of the outcome!  Who cares if you did end up finishing ahead of them, if they continue to behave counter to the GCR rules, they (the competitor) will finally get the hint (I hope).

 

Until we as a group are willing to call the bullshit for what it is (and the stewards will eventually come around to enforcing it if we continue protesting) we will regularly have these kinds of things happen which only serves the person behaving improperly.

 

My $.02...

[Danny Steyn]

Beginner?

 

Keith, no matter how good a driver is, or how experienced he is, unless he has been the lead driver on the restart at that particular track, IMO he is still a "beginner" re-starter. Precisely where the pace car pulls off, and where it becomes legal to pass the pace car, these are all track dependent, and can vary significantly, and will greatly influence where you need to be on the throttle to ensure that the following drivers are not able to carry more momentum past you.

 

There are many drivers that have been racing MANY years at Sebring that have never been the lead car on the restart, and might make the same mistake the Selin made. The learning curve is rapid, and you generally only make this mistake once, but sometimes it takes a few of them before the sensible approach stats to really sink in.

 

Part of a drivers preparation for a particular track should be to study the hundreds of videos featuring re-starts at that track, not just in Spec Miata. There is so much to be learned from watching what works and what doesn't, and where you want be depending on where you are in the field. 

 

Its pretty obvious what I am trying to do in my video, and I honestly believed that Selin would have been on the gas, but when he waits, I have to check up so I don't pass him before the green, and of course that sets me up as the sitting duck, and the field swarms me - so maybe I am the beginner!!!!!

[Craig Berry]

Danny, the start a Sebring can be a fine line. 2014 majors I started from pole and was given a strict warning after the Sat race for lagging back too much behind the pace car. I corrected this on Sun.
I completely agree that if you think your gonna start the field study a lot of video, and maybe even talk to someone you trust who has started at the front of a particular track. Buras had great advice for me at Sebring. We are all one missed shift from being a Beginner!

[Danny Steyn]

Craig - IMO there is a huge difference between the Start and Restart. IMO you cannot hang back at the start, and "should" not hang back at the restart. But it comes down to what you anticipate the stewards are going to do about it, and what they have historically done, as we all know.....

 

I think the distance that Selin is back from the Pace car at the start was about right, but IMO he was too close on the restart and of course the rest of the field could have swarmed him even more....

[Danica Davison]

This here is the problem we as a class have with our competitors.  If you have proof (video goes a long way) of someone stepping out and jumping the start, throw paper!  Regardless of the outcome!  Who cares if you did end up finishing ahead of them, if they continue to behave counter to the GCR rules, they (the competitor) will finally get the hint (I hope).
 
Until we as a group are willing to call the bullshit for what it is (and the stewards will eventually come around to enforcing it if we continue protesting) we will regularly have these kinds of things happen which only serves the person behaving improperly.
 
My $.02...

I agree with you. If the driver is never penalized, or talked to, there is no reason for that guy not to keep doing it.  Personally, I would rather go up to the guy myself and tell him to stop or I will protest if he continues. But, I didn't get the chance as it was the last race of the day and we were all packin up and headed out.   But yes, I do agree 100% with you


hows that John? JD

[Mark McCallister]

It's been a while but I led a restart at Sebring once.  Admittedly it was late in an enduro and we were out of order - I was *not* the leader, I don't remember why it worked out that way.  In any case, we came around 17 with pace car lights on and no sign green was imminent...I was busy playing with my drink tube, chatting on the radio and in 4th gear...and I assume a last second call from the tower came for the pace car to come in...pace car turns lights off and swerves into pit lane in one motion.  Needless to say I was swarmed in seconds...I will *not* make that mistake again...lesson learned...always be ready!