112 replies to this topic

[Johnny D]

And what do you expect the outcome of that value sharing session to be? A he-said she-said with no evidence to support whether or not the contact caused your off? Like I said, who is calling this in? First thing I want to do if it's for a position that matters is get back to the paddock and review my video. If all you are going to do is talk then what does it matter if it happens now or later?
FWIW I finished 21st last weekend, got the same number of points as 45th, and am tied for 105th in the Supertour standings with about 95 other drivers that have failed to score a point. If someone knocked me out of that position it wouldn't really matter. I don't waste energy on stuff that doesn't matter.

FYI NASA's going mandatory video camera 2018

J~

[Ron Alan]

Important to note that you need to get nailed pretty good for NASA to consider it "body contact".  Tire donuts alone don't count.

Sure it does if it results in a position change!

 

Camera's are Mandatory now Dirk and have been for over a year!

[OrangeCrush86]

How do they enforce the camera requirement?

[Danica Davison]

How do they enforce the camera requirement?

 

They do it for MX5 cup too. Within 30 min you have to turn in the miscro sd chip from your camera. They copy the files .. and then give it back to you. If you don't turn it in or if your camera wasn't turned on ... then I am pretty sure you get DQed.

[Johnny D]

Sure it does if it results in a position change!
 
Camera's are Mandatory now Dirk and have been for over a year!

Mandatory in NorCal but not nation wide I believe.
When I posted the rule above I saw the 2018 date.
That's the rules not NorCal supps.

Check your local supps people. YMMV

J~

[LarryKing]

Bear in mind cameras are not fool proof. They occasionally malfunction or forget to be turned on, etc...

[Johnny D]

Ya, it happens. You can hard wire it so the battery doesn't die. Remote control to turn it on. But ya, ops sorry I forgot only weighs better on the other guy.
Funny how much cleaner the racing was when everyone knew they were being video taped

J~

[Bench Racer]

This whole car-to-car contact is no different than a druggy or alcoholic, until the actor between the seat and steering wheel admits he/she has a car-to-car contact issue, nothings going to change. The quickest change process will be for consequences to driver for car-to-car contact issues. When the consequences to driver for car-to-car contact is similar to the consequences to fail to tear your car down, the actors behavior will change in a hurry.

 

How about y'all reply to the SCCA request for car-to-car action. I'm willing to venture the SCCA will enforce existing rules, doubt the SCCA will implement new Rules of the Road, On Course Driver Conduct 

[FTodaro]

Contact Impound - Draft Rule

 

CONTACT-IMPOUND

Every competitor who has had on track contact that results in their car or their competitors car leaving the racing surface (four wheels off), and/or contact that results in the loss of positions on track (punt) is required to report contact impound and fill out a Report Form.

 

Contact to the vehicle body beyond cosmetic damage requiring replacement or repair of body panels requires reporting to impound whether or not there was a loss of track position or Punt.

 

Both competitors must report immediately after coming off the track within 30 minutes of the checkered flag. Failing to report to impound may result in penalties and a finding of fault.

 

 

_________________________________________________________________________________

 

I would envision that each driver is handed a form, If they agree as to what and why it happened the both sign one form and turn it it. If they agree and its not catastrophic, that  is the end of it.

 

If they cannot agree, they each turn in their own form and the Steward, makes the call. and they move on. Its not about penalty, its about education and calling out bad decisions.

[LarryKing]

So, I race at Daytona early May and get bump-clobbered in the bus stop braking zone. The rear trim panel was destroyed and two laps later my Mazdacomp diff goes kerblammo. With no contact impound I'm out a bunch of money to fix my car. With a contact impound I'm out a bunch of money to fix my car, but the offending chucklehead might, maybe, get two points on their license. I feel soooo much better. (Actually I would have been happy if dickhead came to me and apologized)

[Jim Creighton]

I know you guys get tired of hearing how we do it in short track racing but here's another that just happened at Bristol. During the Late Model Stock race, we had a 15 yr old running a car out of a NASCAR shop who seemed to have little regard for others. Finally, after side impacting another driver, he was fined the amount to repair the car he hit. Fine was relayed to him immediately and he was warned if he touched another car, he would be parked. His purse was withheld as down payment on repairs.

 

Maybe a couple of fines like this by SCCA would calm down some of the lack of regard for personal race zones on track. Points are ok but $$ talk. Of course, this would and should only apply when nothing else works. Our 15 yr old had already had this problem at previous two races, BTW, he touched no one last weekend at Anderson.

 

[Jim Drago]

In another case of be careful what you ask for!

The scca response to all the letters etc on contact...

Well the answer was started at Sprints. Every car and mean every car with ANY DAMAGE even as small as a minor tire donut or scuff was written in the log book. We all have thirty days to fix and absolutely not allowed to race Indy with a dented car..

I get the goal.. but would we rather have 80 decent looking race cars or thirty with no dings. We are going to lose many racers with this. I will fix my car as I don't like dents, but many would rather put that 2500/3500 towards racing . This is a mistake... it has its place, but needs a more lenient and understanding approach

Thanks Frank Todaro

[Bench Racer]

Jim, is this the rule used to note logbooks?

 

9.3.6. APPEARANCE NEAT AND CLEAN, AND SUITABLE FOR COMPETITION Specifically, cars that are dirty either externally or in the engine or passenger compartments, or that show bodywork damage, structural or surface rust, or that are partially or totally in primer, or that do not bear the prescribed identification marks shall not be approved for competition.

[Jim Creighton]

I wrote up a good number of cars a few years ago at the Daytona Double SARRC.  Most had old, multi panel body damage. Many voiced their displeasure, but I explained that they had little to loose when they hit someone who had a car that met the GCR rule. There were 2 IT7 cars that did not have one single panel or door that did not have extensive damage. IMO, those guys showed they cared nothing about others space.

 

Yes, there is room for judgement here but at what point does tech call the question? I always raced a car that had no prior damage as did most others. In the past years, I do not recall seeing one front running SM car come to the track with prior damage unless they had just raced the weekend before. And then, some efforts had been made to minimize it. Go look at an IT field at a regional some time. Scary.

 

BTW, no car should ever have a rubber tire mark on it. WD 40 removes rubber. 

 

And I believe every car that comes to the Runoffs should have all body damage fixed. This is our show case event and cars should look presentable. And I did write up two cars in prod last year at Mid Ohio for body work needed. It had to be completed within 60 days or their next event after that time.

[FTodaro]

In another case of be careful what you ask for!

The scca response to all the letters etc on contact...

Well the answer was started at Sprints. Every car and mean every car with ANY DAMAGE even as small as a minor tire donut or scuff was written in the log book. We all have thirty days to fix and absolutely not allowed to race Indy with a dented car..

I get the goal.. but would we rather have 80 decent looking race cars or thirty with no dings. We are going to lose many racers with this. I will fix my car as I don't like dents, but many would rather put that 2500/3500 towards racing . This is a mistake... it has its place, but needs a more lenient and understanding approach

Thanks Frank Todaro

 

Wait a second Jim, if they enforced the contact rules this way, we would not be talking about impound?

 

I like how the under react to some rules and overreact to others.

 

Edit: I will say that if truly is their reaction to the contact that this makes the lack of enforcement even more of a failure as it punishes the innocent party in the contact equally with the guy who caused it. Maybe Mr. Prill can comment?

[FTodaro]

BOYCOTT- the loss of revenue sends a powerful message.

[Jim Drago]

In a very class move... our Vice President mr pence pulled back on this completely this am and took responsibility for not enforcing it sooner.

[Jim Creighton]

Jim, Steve Pence is the Super Tour Chief Steward and not with SCCA as per se. Eric Prill is Chief Operating Officer of Club racing. I would think Pence has been brought up to speed on the latest posts.

 

He's a pretty good guy and very approachable.

[Danica Davison]

I am going to wrap my car to make it look like it has dents and will come with tire donuts on the wrap ... just to watch them think about it

[Rob Burgoon]

In another case of be careful what you ask for!
The scca response to all the letters etc on contact...
Well the answer was started at Sprints. Every car and mean every car with ANY DAMAGE even as small as a minor tire donut or scuff was written in the log book. We all have thirty days to fix and absolutely not allowed to race Indy with a dented car..
I get the goal.. but would we rather have 80 decent looking race cars or thirty with no dings. We are going to lose many racers with this. I will fix my car as I don't like dents, but many would rather put that 2500/3500 towards racing . This is a mistake... it has its place, but needs a more lenient and understanding approach
Thanks Frank Todaro

Ladies and gentlemen, the scca.