Questions you or others have about Hoosiers
#41
Posted 01-18-2012 01:21 PM
#42
Posted 01-18-2012 01:22 PM
I know, I was busting your chops.. But shaved Hoosiers are here and will become more visible at bigger races IMO...
Actually Jim, I don't think we will.
We brought 4 sets of shaved Hoosiers to Florida for Voytek. Ran 3 sets at Sebring and was marginally competitive. At Homestead we tested them back to back on Friday morning. Sticker unshaved vs sticker shaves. The unshaved tires were faster. For Friday afternoon, Saturday and Sunday mornings we ran the shaved. We ran the unshaved for the races. The only race we where really competitive in was the Sunday afternoon race, on 3 heat cycle unshaved. Other than checking toe before each session we made no changes to the car.
I do not have a theroy as to why we found this. But with a sample of one driver at 2 tracks over 4 races we found shaving to be detrimental to Hoosiers.
I do believe that Todd Buras was on heat cycle #9 on his tires
That is what I know
dave
Dave Wheeler
Advanced Autosports, the nations most complete Spec Miata shop
Author, Spec Miata Constructors Guide, version 1 and 2.0
Building Championship winning cars since 1995
4 time Central Division Spec Miata Champion car builder 2012-2013-2014-2017
Back to Back June Sprints Spec Miata 1-2 finishes 2016 and 2017
5 time June Sprints winner in Mazda's
6 Time Northern Conference Champion Car Builder
2014 SCCA Majors National point Champion car builder
2014 SCCA Runoffs winner, T4 (Bender)
2014 Central Division Champion, ITS (Wheeler)
2013 Thunderhill 25 hour winning crew chief
2007 June Sprints winner, (GT1, Mohrhauser)
Over 200 race wins and counting.
www.advanced-autosports.com
dave@advanced-autosports.com
608-313-1230
#43
Posted 01-18-2012 01:57 PM
While I believe what you are saying.. It doesn't make much sense, granted I am no tire engineer. I think when we get to that big dyno in Wi, we will likely see shaved tires again? I know if nothing is done, several of us will have a few sets to try at the Sprints. I really don't know how to insure we don't, but if anyone has any realistic suggestions, I am on board with not allowing as it does nothing but increase the costs for all. It is not allowed now, but not enforceable either, so we will continue to see it.
Any ideas, post them up. Hoosier has said they will not shave the tires but others will.
Jim
East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080
#44
Posted 01-18-2012 02:12 PM
J~
#45
Posted 01-18-2012 02:31 PM
A lot of other classes run R6s and I haven't heard of them shaving them either. Running stickers for qualifying is the approach I hear about most often from other classes.
There are plenty of other known techniques that are known to improve lap times and raise the cost of racing to worry about!
#46
Posted 01-18-2012 03:52 PM
Jim, my dyno isn't that big!!!
FYI, I heard from a reliable source that teh rains do not shave well at all. The tread is not stable enough to shave. Hopefully that will eliminate the need for intermediates.
Dave Wheeler
Advanced Autosports, the nations most complete Spec Miata shop
Author, Spec Miata Constructors Guide, version 1 and 2.0
Building Championship winning cars since 1995
4 time Central Division Spec Miata Champion car builder 2012-2013-2014-2017
Back to Back June Sprints Spec Miata 1-2 finishes 2016 and 2017
5 time June Sprints winner in Mazda's
6 Time Northern Conference Champion Car Builder
2014 SCCA Majors National point Champion car builder
2014 SCCA Runoffs winner, T4 (Bender)
2014 Central Division Champion, ITS (Wheeler)
2013 Thunderhill 25 hour winning crew chief
2007 June Sprints winner, (GT1, Mohrhauser)
Over 200 race wins and counting.
www.advanced-autosports.com
dave@advanced-autosports.com
608-313-1230
#47
Posted 01-18-2012 04:41 PM
Dave
While I believe what you are saying.. It doesn't make much sense, granted I am no tire engineer. I think when we get to that big dyno in Wi, we will likely see shaved tires again? I know if nothing is done, several of us will have a few sets to try at the Sprints. I really don't know how to insure we don't, but if anyone has any realistic suggestions, I am on board with not allowing as it does nothing but increase the costs for all. It is not allowed now, but not enforceable either, so we will continue to see it.
Any ideas, post them up. Hoosier has said they will not shave the tires but others will.
Jim
Jim, if we can't enforce, we (the CRB letter writers) should seriously consider legalizing. The only way the unenforceable ban avoids increasing the costs for all is by excluding and penalizing the honest racers.
#48
Posted 01-18-2012 07:56 PM
Doug, if you could run wheels that were 1 lb plus lighter legally, would you? Well a 1 lb lighter tire is better than that The more testing done, the faster shaved Hoosiers will be IMO.. Especially at Road America when a few tenths separates most over 4 miles.
East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080
#49
Posted 01-18-2012 08:04 PM
#50
Posted 01-18-2012 08:20 PM
East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080
#51
Posted 01-18-2012 11:16 PM
www.miatacage.com
360-606-7734
#52
Posted 01-19-2012 08:12 AM
Not me.
Stupid (rhetorical) question - Wasn't the lack of shaving part of the rational for switching to Hoosier?
#53
Posted 01-19-2012 08:36 AM
Stupid (rhetorical) question - Wasn't the lack of shaving part of the rational for switching to Hoosier?
Yes, sort of. The Hoosiers will still help folks that don't prep/spend to the max by not having to shave vs. Toyos (no choice there).
The folks that spent shaving tires to pretty thin before, the additional cost of a shaving is not probably an issue.
James York
sponsored by:
Stan's Auto Center, Lafayette LA
powered by:
East Street Racing, Memphis TN
2003 Spec Miata
#03
#54
Posted 01-19-2012 08:37 AM
And the SCCA is wondering how to increase participation at nationals. Unless you've got a huge race budget you're just doing laps. Who wants to show up knowing they're field filler.
Not me.
Stupid (rhetorical) question - Wasn't the lack of shaving part of the rational for switching to Hoosier?
Not sure how the SCCA fixes this? If you are a field filler in SCCA, you will be a field filer at any competitive NASA race as well. SCCA regionals, well it depends... Some regionals are just as competitive as nationals?
We shaved Toyo's to less than 1/32 for the Runoffs... People will do what they can to gain an advantage. We(racers collectively) are the problem.
East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080
#55
Posted 01-19-2012 09:07 AM
We(racers collectively) are the problem.
I'm just say'n the bar keeps going up until only a very few can compete. (The proverbial 20-30 douchebags - and I say that with all due respect)
I don't think it can be fixed either - same old problem for last 7-8 years.
Maybe the next 'spec' class can get it right.
#56
Posted 01-19-2012 09:18 AM
And the SCCA is wondering how to increase participation at nationals. Unless you've got a huge race budget you're just doing laps. Who wants to show up knowing they're field filler.
Not me.
Stupid (rhetorical) question - Wasn't the lack of shaving part of the rational for switching to Hoosier?
Im a field filler and I still want to race nationals
#57
Posted 01-19-2012 09:31 AM
Maybe the next 'spec' class can get it right.
I think despite the fact that we all complain( myself included), none of like the costs involved. I think this Spec class got it pretty close to right and gets better every year. Sure things could be different, but not sure different is better either? The tighter we make the rules and the competition, the more small and expensive gains will show up.
East Street Auto Parts
Jim@Eaststreet.com
800 700 9080
#58
Posted 01-19-2012 09:43 AM
Could make the runoffs fun with the week of qualifying.
#59
Posted 01-19-2012 09:55 AM
#60
Posted 01-19-2012 09:59 AM
1 user(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users