145 replies to this topic

[Rob Burgoon]

Could spec a new crystal to solder onto the ECU's circuit board I'd imagine.

[Jamz14]

Ron,

I am being playful and not sarcastic when I say, if you read those novels with attention, you would see that I haven't shown much interest in how the current spec set was come to, and only really interested in how it is changed IF there is evidence of a need. A touchy subject it seems.

I know our biggest pace gains are with the driver. We are both working hard on that. Rob has been around us in the pits a bit now. He might think of me as a helicopter dad I don't know. But I can tell you that I work hard on staying in the background at the track as much as possible. I work hard on his car and trying to help him with his driving. But Nova is responsible for his track side interactions at drivers meetings and with officials if necessary. For our program, Nova and I both have to work hard together. Many drivers like Rob can campaign successfully alone. We can't. What many people don't know about Nova is that he works everyday after school talking to businesses and talking to city officials trying to build his racing program from the ground up to be a top notch program some day. He cannot do great in school, run a business, be a kid sometimes, drive a car, and develop a top notch car all at the same time without having great partners and help. You all have been critical for this. Almost every single person on this forum has contributed to where we are at today and I thank each and every one of you sincerely. I'd like to think that I am critical for him too. Being together was the reason we started this in the first place. I am thrilled we are meeting our goal. Winning is goal #2!!

Rob, wish I could join and support you for the rev limiter thing. But I am not qualified at this time. If we can get a podium next year then maybe .

[Rob Burgoon]

Well, put it this way, if the dad spends more time on the forums than the driver, I start hearing a faint "whomp-whomp-whomp".

However, my experience with Ron and James and Nova has all been positive so far, so I can't complain. These dads seem be avoiding soccer-dad syndrome which I'm sure many appreciate.

Thanks for the support James, but to get a rev limiter thing (or any other rule change) you need two things.

1. some letters
2. (critical) buy in from the tribe "elders"

#2 is the hard part

p.s. no, you don't have to be old to be a "tribe elder"

[Keith Novak]

I'm thinking:
1. Vegas
2. Tequila
3. Polaroid camera (digital these days I suppose)
4. some letters

That makes (critical) buy in from the "elders" easier.

[Ron Alan]

No worries James... wasn't being critical. I wear Helicopter dad as a badge of honor, much better than absentee dad! In all honesty I'm on here strictly for myself and stay out of my sons way...he gets to fight his own battles when necessary. I just like to keep up with what's going on and whats new. I show up all the time without my son at the track to hang out with the SM family...keeps me sane!

The current rule set will start being looked at closer in another 18 months...this is when your thoughts as well as others will be listened to more intently. Both NASA and SCCA said 3 years...and I think things are close enough this will stand. But if it really bothers you dump that 97 and get a NB car...they are like driving caddies, have great aerodynamics, torque out the ying yang, and they are so new nothing ever breaks Just don't bust a tail light or head light, either bumper or god forbid the front spoiler..$$$

[Rob Burgoon]

A crystal change might not be practical if the crystal we'd need doesn't exist.

Anyone know what the rev limits of a 1.6, 1.8, 99, and 01 are?

Is it 7000 for 1.8 and 7200 for the rest? If so, we need about a 3% faster crystal.

[Keith Novak]

I see 7k at the peak of rattling my rev limiter in my '95. I think it's supposed to be 6900 which is pretty consistent with what I see in my data. It's under the 7k line (which if that means I need a better ECU, someone tell me because I could sure use another 100 rpm).

[James York]

My 99 won't wind up past 7000.

Looking at some of my old data traces, my 1.6 zinged to at least 7150.

When I had a 95, I didn't have data, and my memory from that long ago is shot.

[Ron Alan]

Per Jim awhile back 1.6...7200 NA 1.8...6900 1.8 NB...7000

[Jim Drago]

Per Jim awhile back 1.6...7200 NA 1.8...6900 1.8 NB...7000

[john mueller]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA !

[Ron Alan]

past you bed time champ! better get your rest for next year AC is coming with a posse of gators...its war
Danny Steyn impersonation

[pat slattery]

Our 1.6 is about 7100

[JRHille]

Let the 1.6 get rid of the stupid flapper door AFM. Seems like a great idea, but I don't really know what I'm talking about or if this is even possible. Our a/f curve SUCKS and the car changes every day and throughout the race drastically.

[DrDomm]

Damn, I missed wasting time posting this weekend because I was racing...what a novel idea.

Anyway, here's my thoughts...I'm still getting beat by other '94-'97's. So, I'll defer asking for rules changes til I clear that up.

Second, I kinda think the idea is that the '99+ is "The Spec Miata". The rules are there to allow us to stay in the race using the earlier cars. It might be nice if we could just all run '99's and take the restrictor off. Perhaps someday. There does come a time when cars have to be retired or moved to Vintage Racing.

Anyway, here's to being an underdog.

[Jamz14]

Rob,

I'd send you a PM on this if your box had any space in it. So how much to hot shoe the car? Is there an opportunity this weekend during practice at the BW race?

J.

[Alex Bolanos]

Anyway, here's my thoughts...I'm still getting beat by other '94-'97's. So, I'll defer asking for rules changes til I clear that up.

This deserves emphasis... is Nova the top placing NA8 car? In the first 5 nationals of the year I was the only NA8 in the top 10 and Buras the only NA6, that's what the boys are alluding to. It's not that you need "street cred" but that you should be careful claiming the car is holding you back until the car is holding you back...

[Jamz14]

Hey Alex,

Thanks for the input. I want to be clear here. I never once said it was the car holding us back. What I was trying to say was that if there are experienced people ( and I know a couple of them) that feel the car has some development work to be done, then the process for making those adjustments should be fairly painless and easy to make those changes. Also, if there is an impression, not saying it is a fact, that the car is disadvantaged, then we will never find out if it is or not if no one of high experience and reputable status will build one to know.

Also, to all. I misread John's comments. I thought I detected a hint that he felt some work needed to be done on the car. Evidently this is not the case. If John says the car is on par, then in my opinion the car is on par based on John's assessment and time working on these cars.

But let me ask, if you were the only top 10 NA, what does that tell us? And I am really asking here and not trying to say something. Does that mean you were the only top prepped car of that year? Does that mean that no one else will build the car? Do you have so much experience that you can take a disadvantaged car and place it in the top 10? What is all of the data from guys like you telling us about the car? I have been asking you guys what your experience is, not trying to apply my uneducated views on the subject. And I am also trying to address what would be needed to review if someone wanted to make a case that the car needed some parity adjustments.

That is all. We are not the type of team that blames the regs for our lack of performance. We are also not the type of team that "stretches" the rules. So maybe our car isn't the car to get data from.

J

[Rob Burgoon]

Mailbox clear.

[Alex Bolanos]

But let me ask, if you were the only top 10 NA, what does that tell us?

There are several reasons for this that have already been addressed by the rulemakers.

1) The NA8 came with the 4.10 rear gear which was a disadvantage at all but one or two tracks east of the 'ol miss. Fixed.
2) The NA8 was also burdened with the NB front swaybar which made tuning understeer out hopeless (in '10 I used to run toe OUT in the rear to get it to work). Fixed
3) SM was founded on the NA6 90-93 Miata platform, those who choose to build a newer car upgrade right to the NB and skip the NA8 altogether. I believe this is why most old SMs are 90-93 and new are 99-2000.

Does that mean you were the only top prepped car of that year?

To my knowledge in SCCA SE there were two NA8 cars in top prep shape early in the year, mine and LaBounty's rental which AC drove at the NASA Champs.

Does that mean that no one else will build the car? Do you have so much experience that you can take a disadvantaged car and place it in the top 10? What is all of the data from guys like you telling us about the car?

I don't know everything there is to know about SM, especially why people build a particular gen of car but... Personally I've built (both with Rossini and Autotechnik power) a 94 and a 99 that can run top 5-10 nationally and I have no reason to believe that my 1.6 build won't have the pace. This is in large part to the work that Mueller and others have done.