146 replies to this topic

[MPR22]

Michael

 

Your too hard on yourself.. Several good things did come out of the weekend.

First and foremost.. You earned the pretty East street racing sticker, signed no less by yours truly losing your qualifying bet..

 

Second.. The why story with your dad was one of the funniest things I have ever heard..

 

Lastly, I really wish you would have called me.. I had that harness, I actually used it Sunday morning, my guys put it the car in about 10-12 minutes. That harness is VERY easy to change as you will find out. You need a smaller guy than you likely, but it is easy. 

 

Seriously, sorry for your misfortune. You are a good sport and a lot of fun. 

 

Jim

The worst part about losing the bet is that I owe Blake $10.00. 

[Brendan O]

I love my new car. You can see some photos here:

 

http://tomhartracing.com/

 

and here

 

http://tomhartracing.com/?page_id=293

 

HOLY CRAP !!! That is too cool.

 

Was there any damage to it?

[CruzanTom]

HOLY CRAP !!! That is too cool.

 

Was there any damage to it?

 

Hit in qualifying and broke the right lower control arm. OPM fixed that and I got hit in the same place and same fender in Sunday's race, resulting in a flat tire. Fowler, Collins and Pace patched me up so it looked like a little black eye on RF fender. See the first photo in the gallery below on this page. Car ran great!

 

http://tomhartracing.com/?page_id=516

[Brendan O]

Damage to such a beautiful car first time out kinda sucks

[William Keeling]

I won all my bets, moved up both days, race car came home as it left and I got faster all week so all in all a good week.

 

Thanks Phillip Race Prep for a car that did not miss a beat all week.

 

Thanks to X-Factorperformance for a motor that took me from 41 to 29 Sunday; It was not my driving . It also did not miss a beat.  More than one driver asked who built the thumper.

 

Only bad luck was my street car took a dump on the way to the track.

 

I hope we get to do this again!

[KW78]

 

 

STL race was fun, ran the SM in ITS trim ( no plate) and
started from the back since I didn't race yesterday and got to third.
 The alphabet soup racing is tough.. It can be crazy.  What I can tell
is the best drivers are definitely in SM

 

Jim

 

 

Hey Jim,

 

Seriously where did you start from?  This was one of my big bitches about the weekend, how grid and the split starts were handled. 

 

My trans Jammed in the Phantom 3rd gear on saturdays race as I was shifting from 4th to 5th on the back straight, so I had to pull over after completing 3/4 of the first lap, last in STL.  By my account I should have started with you on my tail.

 

I was hoping to at least have a race up thru the field on sunday, but I was in the back, behind a slew of spec 7's running STL, with the only car behind me being a minicooper that was late getting on the track. 

 

Did you see the green flag come out?  The group I was in wouldn't close up at all, and after the many road america debacles about if a guy can keep the pace or not and you are "in fact passing under a double yellow" if you pass him, even if he points you by - so there I was stuck 45 god damn seconds from the green flag when my radio guy said green green green.

 

The pace car drivers did a terrible job, and the starter should have waived it off again like saturday.

 

While many here are very understanding about how this was a first big event, and a first event at COTA, the more I thought about it on the way home the more pissed off I am.  This is a standard ole split start people!!!! WTF?!    Send group 2 out on the ass of group 1 and then hold the front rows up to get a gap, closing the back rows.  You only had a 20 row group to get right. 

 

Very dissapointed.

 

And while there are alot of Pros about this event, probably more than Cons, and I too appreciate all the volunteer efforts, there are plenty of mandatory improvments this event needs to be plausible to travel to again. 

 

Kyle

50 STL

[Matt Reynolds]

Overall, it was a pretty amazing and unique weekend.  Sure it had its hiccups, but who wasn't expecting that?  Overall the Lone Star Region and Circuit of the Americas staff did a good job all weekend.  

 

The races went fairly well despite massive amounts of contact.  I can't blame anyone for it because we all wanted that extra inch of the track and most did not have serious consequences, a couple did.  The weekend seemed to have a Runoffs atmosphere to it with how deep the field was, and probably added some ambitious, optimistic, and aggressive moves; everyone wanted to win in every corner of every lap.

 

I want to thank Bob Thorton and Race Engineering for all their hard work in providing consistently competitive motors that allow me to run at the top of the class.  I just need to work on driver development to put it a little further up.  Huge thanks to Danny Puskar and Carbotech Brakes.  I was glad to see the support and attention given to this weekend.  They are always helpful and desire success for all their drivers.  

 

Lastly I want to thank any and all the SM drivers for their support as I run the E Production class.  I don't know how many people came up to me after the weekend and congratulated me.  It really says something about our class and I hope I continue to represent it well.  Thanks again everyone.

 

-Sideshow

[Caveman-kwebb99]

I think you also have to remember who your are chooseing to race with when you choose to race iin STL...  Lots of IT cars out there running STL so they can race COTA!  People with no race craft are never gonna close up on the guy ahead of them.  its just life.  Thats why I stay out of the whole STL thing.  I am giving PRO IT a try fot first time next weekend, but I have low esxpectations of the other drivers if they are not driving SM's in the race.  With my low expectaions it will hard for them to disapoint  me

 

The event was a very big success, yes it needs some improvments, just like most of us need to do with our racing...

[Jim Drago]

Hey Jim,

 

Seriously where did you start from?  

Kyle

50 STL

 

Kyle

I have no IDEA!! I was supposed top start last, they put me out second in the group and the guy who 2nd to last at pole. I stopped at the splitter and refused to go out, especially after the sprints debacle)  I politely told him they made a mistake and that I was supposed to be LAST, not first in that group. We went back and forth and was finally told if I wanted to race, I better get going, so I went. I did not want to start on the pole, so I stopped three times on track, each time thinking I was at the end of the grid. The last time I didnt see any cars until I turned in at 12, there were cars hundreds of yards behind the main pack.  They never caught up or tried to. So I was the tail end of the pack that decided to atleast run with the pace car, maybe 10-12 behind, but I have no idea?  It was a real mess

Jim

[Cnj]

Kyle
I have no IDEA!! I was supposed top start last, they put me out second in the group and the guy who 2nd to last at pole. I stopped at the splitter and refused to go out, especially after the sprints debacle)  I politely told him they made a mistake and that I was supposed to be LAST, not first in that group. We went back and forth and was finally told if I wanted to race, I better get going, so I went. I did not want to start on the pole, so I stopped three times on track, each time thinking I was at the end of the grid. The last time I didnt see any cars until I turned in at 12, there were cars hundreds of yards behind the main pack.  They never caught up or tried to. So I was the tail end of the pack that decided to atleast run with the pace car, maybe 10-12 behind, but I have no idea?  It was a real mess
Jim

Jim, you did a pretty good job of trying to put yourself towards the back. I passed you at the exit of 11 and saw a bunch of other STL's come by you. The false grid was a mess for your start, but to be fair they understood almost immediately after you pulled out that they had made a mistake and there was lots of hand waving and face making amoungst the grid workers behind you. I think they simply could not come up with a plan quickly to fix the error.

On the whole it was a good experience for me. I had worked on the project for 2 years and so to finally race there was very cool. My car had multiple problems including a blown diff which killed two practice sessions; electrical fault which killed another and a leaking radiator which had to be replaced. However if ever there was a race to have car problems this was the race to have it as everyone was there. Jim Drago found us a diff (thanks Jeff LaBounty) and did a swap back with Jeff, Ed Gilfus helped us with the electrical, and Jim sold me his backup radiator. Ann from Advanced Autosports went way out of her way to put numbers on my car. I was seriously impressed.

Fun meeting so many people from other parts of the country.

Saturday was exceptional. Aggressive racing (mostly in STL) but tremendous fun. SM race reminded me how good the drivers are in this class - and I was running upper mid field. The guys at the front are awesome drivers.

Sunday was a little frustrating. Very aggressive driving in STL and I was the meat in a 3 car sandwich at middle/exit of T1 (mustang on inside who tracked out and STL/SM on outside who angled in with a clear determination to stay on the black stuff) and I ended up with a fractured bone in my hand. Continued the race but could not hold steering wheel by the end so day was over. Took a handful of ibuprofen and went up to the T3 bridge to watch you lunatics race. Fun to see the strategy games

Hope to race you'all there again next year.

CNJ

[Jim Daniels - FIG]

It was some kind of Runoffs type of racing....

I did not get to socialize much because apparently 2 days early is late so we had to park in the overflow. Place was packed!!!!

What a weekend to decide on for my return to racing. As some may know I took off in 2010 to coach and in 2012 had two open heart surgeries. It was hell to just get my license back.

Pratt Cole has loaned me his EP car. This is the first Miata to get a log book in the USA and the second Miata to win a national event as a SSC car. It is also the first car to win a production race and Runoffs. It is the car that sparked EP and FP Miata racing. I plan to keep it for vintage racing once my Runoffs desires are over.

Back to SM. JD had them covered on speed had mechanicals not prevailed. AC drove the wheels off, he will win most of them when he decides too, and Berry/Alex were rewarded for a smooth drive. The 1.6 of Verges was impressive too and he won the Sat SRF event, an awesome accomplishment!! As always the top guys from all teams were stellar!

I do the color often when at the track and will try to assist at Hallett. I was suppose to so Sat but the PBS tranny and lack of crew decided different. If you liked the call, let SCCA know. I will sneak some comments in on our MavTv show this year about SM. I'm open to all interesting stories so just email me.

Special thanks to Pat S for the suit patch at the podium!

Yes I'm back, not sure why, guess its in my blood.....

[Michael Novak]

I saw two problems clearly this weekend with drivers.

1. Drivers mid pack and back not grouping up for the start. The STL start was the worst i saw. There were cars still on the back straight when the green flag was thrown-wtf. I watched them going around the track and they made almost no effort to catchup. They and the people behind them had zero chance of doing well.

2. Once the double yellows came out many drivers forgot that the green flag would ever come out. Parts of the field fell 1/2 lap behind by not paying any attention. They were in a race not a sunday drive. I would have taken out the mini driver who lost his group at least a 1/4 mile of track when the green flag came back out saturday. He was paying zero attention and it cost every stl driver a chance to run with the rest of the group.


This being said some issues were the grid not having the split groups leave right after the last.. The pace drivers were also going way to fast

[KW78]

Kyle

I have no IDEA!! I was supposed top start last, they put me out second in the group and the guy who 2nd to last at pole. I stopped at the splitter and refused to go out, especially after the sprints debacle)  I politely told him they made a mistake and that I was supposed to be LAST, not first in that group. We went back and forth and was finally told if I wanted to race, I better get going, so I went. I did not want to start on the pole, so I stopped three times on track, each time thinking I was at the end of the grid. The last time I didnt see any cars until I turned in at 12, there were cars hundreds of yards behind the main pack.  They never caught up or tried to. So I was the tail end of the pack that decided to atleast run with the pace car, maybe 10-12 behind, but I have no idea?  It was a real mess

Jim

 

Hey Jim,

 

Thanks for trying.  That actually makes me feel better because the main reason I wanted to go to the event was to feel out the front of the STL pack, then I got stuck where I was, partly on my own doing from saturday..  As it was I had fun driving thru backmarkers (and makes for good hero video ), but I really didn't get a sense whether or not I can hang with you guys race effort and/or driving wise.  I had a top ten fast lap dealing w. traffic, so that is my only feedback. 

 

BTW congrats on fast lap.  Scary that is in your "ITS" car and not the STL one.  I heard you have 300 more HP in the STL one....

 

I think you also have to remember who your are chooseing to race with when you choose to race iin STL...  Lots of IT cars out there running STL so they can race COTA!  People with no race craft are never gonna close up on the guy ahead of them.  its just life.  Thats why I stay out of the whole STL thing.  I am giving PRO IT a try fot first time next weekend, but I have low esxpectations of the other drivers if they are not driving SM's in the race.  With my low expectaions it will hard for them to disapoint  me

 

The event was a very big success, yes it needs some improvments, just like most of us need to do with our racing...

 

I have no problem with those guys.  Glad they were there.  It is a club wide problem about allowing for people at the back that want to not be in the swarm at green flag time.   That's OK, we just need rules that lets people sort that out during the few moments you have to realize that on the pace lap.

 

My problem is with:

 

Grid and Timing & Scoring - -   Instead of having split start grid sheets printed out from T&S, they were doing something else.  I have no idea.  (In this region we print out the grid different, and do successful split starts about every race).  They didn't have that at all, and as my crew guy tried to point that out to grid chief with me barking over the radio, the general response was "wait till we are done parking cars here...".   Then of course its too late...  Logic???

 

PACE CAR DRIVERS:  They should have sent the vette out and parked him under the bridge, and gathered field one.  Just like Road America, you pull out of grid from these mega fields and pair up, then proceed.  PACE CAR #2 should be sent out on the ass of the last of group 1.  It takes a few seconds to get going behind the guy in front of you, get past and acknowledge the field splitter, and then on track.  Well a few seconds each after 40 cars is a minute.  The Fiat pace car should have been moving slowly until the corners seen us paired up.  By that time, group 1 has a gap, and both groups are paired up. 

 

Supertour Race Control:  Basically, for a format that has a slow ceremony, the competitors track time was shortened significantly.  What happened to the 20 vs 15 minute qualifying sessions that was announced before the event?  And when sunday qualifying was scrapped to run group 7  as race 1, the left over time of seven 15 minute qualifying sessions (105 minutes) that was swapped for a 30 minute race should have been added to all races.    They could have added 10 minutes to each race, had a shorter schedule of on-track minutes, and still saved 7 group changeovers (from the scrapped qualifying) and still had a much shorter sunday schedule than original.

 

Basically, I expect Supertour and Runoffs level events to fiercely guard my track time if they expect people to travel to these events.  To shorten the competitors time by more than 10 percent on the fly to allow for falling behind should of been the last thing done, not the first thing done.  Lets get moving somewhere else...

 

The small bore sedan and SM groups were the smoothest groups by the way.  I was there with formula cars and had friends competing in big bore, and they had similar problems and more and only a handful of green flag laps on top of that. 

 

Lots of improvements need engineered here. 

 

Its doable and I hope it does get done.  I don't mind the growing pains but some things are just experience of running events and nothing to do with COTA.  If I don't compete in this event again I certainly would volunteer for the pace car job and get that right.

 

Kyle

[CruzanTom]

I saw two problems clearly this weekend with drivers.

1. Drivers mid pack and back not grouping up for the start. The STL start was the worst i saw. There were cars still on the back straight when the green flag was thrown-wtf. I watched them going around the track and they made almost no effort to catchup. They and the people behind them had zero chance of doing well.
 

 

The first SM race had a screwed up start, too. I heard "Green, green, green!" on my radio as I came through the carousel (I was near the back) only to run into a double yellow still out on T 19. My thoughts were either 1) T19 flaggers f'ed up, but if I pass, I'll get called in and a possible black flag, or 2) Maybe there was a big pile up at the start and the Double yellow was AFTER the green. Turns out #1 was right. Most racers from about P30 on back were screwed up by the T19 flaggers.

 

I spoke to the Race Steward Sunday morning and he apologized and promised Sunday would be better. Later, the finish of the race was F'ed up as the checker came out a lap late. See Danny's video for the best race lap that never counted.

[Jim Drago]

Hey Jim,

 

Thanks for trying.  That actually makes me feel better because the main reason I wanted to go to the event was to feel out the front of the STL pack, then I got stuck where I was, partly on my own doing from saturday.. 

Kyle

 

Kyle

While I cant say for certain.. I did three getting up to speed laps in my STL car and ran 38.3 on lap 3 in a lot of traffic an not really pushing it very much 75% or so.  I feel very certain that I would have easily run 36's, but lost engine in lap 4 see the other thread  I would call my car 75%-85% effort. I think you could spend 85-100k on a "good" STL car if you wanted to.  If I am spending a 100k on a car, it will not be a miata.  A certain primate s building a full blown STL car is the rumor, I imagine a full blown car will have me covered by 1-1.5 seconds. This class will get expensive very fast

Jim

[KW78]

Kyle

While I cant say for certain.. I did three getting up to speed laps in my STL car and ran 38.3 on lap 3 in a lot of traffic an not really pushing it very much 75% or so.  I feel very certain that I would have easily run 36's, but lost engine in lap 4 see the other thread  I would call my car 75%-85% effort. I think you could spend 85-100k on a "good" STL car if you wanted to.  If I am spending a 100k on a car, it will not be a miata.  A certain primate s building a full blown STL car is the rumor, I imagine a full blown car will have me covered by 1-1.5 seconds. This class will get expensive very fast

Jim

 

 

So much for an AS alternate for tinkering if that is true.  They should introduce 160hp SIRs now before a 100K car shows up and kills the class.  I really like the tinkering aspect with the addition of simple, somewhat spec aero, and dot tires.  One would hope this club would learn from past experiences like the AS class.

 

Ya the MX5 ran 38's on saturday.  Not sure what happened to him on sunday.  The acura had the field well covered in a straight line I think.

 

I ran a 41 with my ITA effort so I could see a 36.  I hate to think of a 100K miata as well, but I'll hang in there for awhile until that happens.

 

Kyle

[Mike Asselta]

I saw two problems clearly this weekend with drivers.

1. Drivers mid pack and back not grouping up for the start. The STL start was the worst i saw. There were cars still on the back straight when the green flag was thrown-wtf. I watched them going around the track and they made almost no effort to catchup. They and the people behind them had zero chance of doing well.

2. Once the double yellows came out many drivers forgot that the green flag would ever come out. Parts of the field fell 1/2 lap behind by not paying any attention. They were in a race not a sunday drive. I would have taken out the mini driver who lost his group at least a 1/4 mile of track when the green flag came back out saturday. He was paying zero attention and it cost every stl driver a chance to run with the rest of the group.


This being said some issues were the grid not having the split groups leave right after the last.. The pace drivers were also going way to fast

Michael nailed it....in the B-Spec Mini we were stuck behind drivers that would not form up for the start and did not understand how to close up during the full course caution.  Very frustrating to be in a National Race with so many drivers that do not understand these basic rules and no help from the pace car.  My only complaint in an otherwise terrific event put on by Lone Star.

[Rob Burgoon]

If someone's not closing up, perhaps they need a push?

[Danny Steyn]

WRT to drivers not closing up during the pace lap, there are many of us at the front that are NOT helping the situation. If we continue to weave left and right scrubbing tires all the way up to turn 19, then these is just too much gap to be made up by the back drivers to close up. It takes time to form up and you CANNOT do it until the row ahead has formed.

 

IMHO we, (the front drivers) need to form up two by two at least 2-3 turns before the start line to allow the rest of the field to do the same. If we form up, close the gap earlier on, it will allow the rest of the field to close and at least give them a shot. But if a strung out start is what we are aiming for then we are doing the right thing. I expressed this at the 2012 June Sprints meeting and we were formed up by T12 at Road America, so it can be done.

 

I'll be honest, In viewing many of the videos taken from the grandstands this weekend at COTA, I was embarrassed to see the drivers at the back of our class only coming onto the start straight as we are going into into Turn 1. Some of the blame rests squarely at our feet. I am not saying it is entirely our fault but we should try to make this a fair race.

 

Fire away!

[granracing]

Lots of IT cars out there running STL so they can race COTA!  People with no race craft are never gonna close up on the guy ahead of them. 

 

Not like SM has a repution of its own even if not true.  It's the drivers - not the category. (Just sold my ITB car with a Kessler SM car on the way.)

 

Danny is spot on. I've been in enough situations (the Glen is another good example) where leaders are on the straight and by not forming up soon enough mid pack drivers are multiple turns away.