74 replies to this topic

[davew]

Ok guys, let's do this right the first time.

 

I am willing to create the "standard"

 

I am ordering all the parts to do a few of these. I will order all the matching colored wires and post pix and descriptions so everybody can make them the same. If you want to sell them, FINE. If you just want to match everybody else, FINE TOO. If you want to do them your way, that is FINE also.

 

Give me a week or so to get everything here and assembled.

 

If everybody follows the same pattern it will be better for all of us.

[FTodaro]

. Now, which end will be male/female?

you always did get that confused.

[Todd Lamb]

We will be using the Jeg's version with the female pigtail on the sensor, male end on the wiring harness. That's about all the standard you need.

 

For pics - see Tiley's post on page one. Exactly like that.

[Johnny D]

Todd, if you put the connector on the wire harness clocked at, lets say pin 1 or a green wire and Dan clocks his at pin 2 or white wire.
When you plug it in, it will be wire incorrect. If you swapped harnesses.
Follow?
J~

[davew]

Not only do you need the 3 wires in the correct orientation, you also need the pins to be male and female on the correct locations.

 

Like I said, I will post how I am going to do it. If you want to follow, great. If not, have at it yourself. Just give me enough time to get everything here.

 

dave

[Dan Tiley]

Here's the standard we're using:

 

Deutsch Connector:   http://www.jegs.com/.../10781/10002/-1

 

Sensor side gets male pins

Harness side gets female pins

 

Solder directly to Sensor Pins:

1- Red (#1 is closest to mounting bolt)

2- Blue

3- Black

 

Sensor Connector (male pins):

A- Red

B- Blue

C- Black

 

Factory Harness (female pins):

A- White/Red

B- White/Blue

C- Black 

 

Feel free to use this standard if you like!

[Johnny D]

Clocking still matters and your not telling us Dan.

In the 3rd picture over in the jegs links. Showing the orange back side.
What is A, B, and C?

The connector only goes one way and after to put it on the harness your clocked, so it important if you use someone else's harness that's it's the same.
Follow ?
J~

[davew]

Thanks Dan, that is what I will use.

 

Johnny D, the plastic housings should have molded letters so you know where to put everything.

 

dave

[Johnny D]

Ok, I looked and only saw a T5.
Thanks Guys,
carry on.
J~

[NPiekarski]

When Soldering the wires to the pins in the sensor, what are you using inside the existing plug hole of the sensor as a isolator? In Dan's picture it looks grey but I am having a hard time seeing what it is.

[Johnny D]

I'd guess a high temp silicone, squirt some in.

The wires are a heavier insulated/heat resistant wire?
J~

[tynor]

When Soldering the wires to the pins in the sensor, what are you using inside the existing plug hole of the sensor as a isolator? In Dan's picture it looks grey but I am having a hard time seeing what it is.

 

I potted mine with epoxy.

[Dan Tiley]

Johnny... like Dave said, the Deutsch connectors have "A", "B" and "C" molded into the housing.  I personally used grey silicone, but epoxy would work well too.  Just trying to keep water out of the sensor, and also keep the wires from shorting out on each other.  The electrical guru's of the world may have a better suggestion, but it's been working fine thus far.

 

This pic should help (protective sheathing removed)

 

[Jamz14]

Somebody help me here..

James, I think the rules already state, #1 and 2 are allowed with an OEM/Equivalent like one of the 1st links posted.
J~

Johnny, if the rule already states that we have a solution, why do we need the press release from the SCCA allowing us aftermarket connectors? Is your point that this whole thread is at best redundant? At worse not necessary? If folks have had this ability all along, why are guys taping their connectors in place instead of cutting them off and replacing? Honestly I didn't check the rules for allowing me an aftermarket connector. I just assumed that if it was being addressed by Lamb and others, that must mean there was a need. Good to know though that I am fully allowed to clip off any connector and replace with an equivalent!!!!!

[Johnny D]

Have you read the title James ??

To fix the problem the can sensors needs to be directly soldered.
This makes it all one piece and not replaceable, unless you unsoldered, dig out silicone.

So you need the new connectors, so if your at the track, you unplug, swap, plug in and go.

I can't speak for guys not fully knowing the rules, not the 1st, not the last time.
J~

[Jamz14]

I get that Johnny. But if it was allowed already, why the need for a bulletin? That is all I am saying. You know that the title of topics doesn't usually show where the conversation drifts to. I very well might be missing something in this thread as initially I ignored this thread seeing how I don't have cam sensor issues at this time. But because I am building a 99 and anticipate the same electrical gremlins that other 99 owners are experiencing I decided to look. And I see a bulletin that was just released saying we can use any connector for only the cam position sensor and maybe falsely assumed that replacement with at least an after market connector was not legal. My mistake and I will clip and replace at will.

 

I still think item 3 is valid and a good discussion though. And I haven't heard any good arguments on why we could just as easily make a complete wiring harness rule just as easily as it seems this rule was adopted. Not a big deal though.

[Johnny D]

Knock yourself out James.

Thank you for posting at MazdaRacers.com where we care.
J~

[davew]

Johnny, if the rule already states that we have a solution, why do we need the press release from the SCCA allowing us aftermarket connectors? Is your point that this whole thread is at best redundant? At worse not necessary? If folks have had this ability all along, why are guys taping their connectors in place instead of cutting them off and replacing? Honestly I didn't check the rules for allowing me an aftermarket connector. I just assumed that if it was being addressed by Lamb and others, that must mean there was a need. Good to know though that I am fully allowed to clip off any connector and replace with an equivalent!!!!!

Most of the connectors are not available as a loose piece. The cam sensor connector shown earlier does not actually fit a Miata. I tried it years ago. I did find one that did fit out of Japan. But it did not solve the missfire issue.

 

But soldering wires directly to the sensor would not be a normal dealer approved repair, so it would not be compliant in SCCA. Neither would adding the Deutsch connector. So many people have had so many problems with cam sensors, that this fix needed to be specificly addressed so as not to turn into "CAM_SENSOR_ GATE"

 

Trying to build a dedicated SM wire harness would cost thousands of dollars in development. Virtually every year would have a different harness 90,91,92 and 93 are the same, 94, 95 early, 95 late, 96-97, 99, 2000, 2001. Beyond that they may be the same.

 

This is a needed rule and a needed confirmation that this practice is compliant. The rule is well written. Having written rules, I know how difficult getting the wording right can be. Good job to those involved

 

Thank You for your input

 

dave

[Jamz14]

Thank you Dave. You addressed my questions in good faith and provided a good faith response. I tend to disagree on the dedicated wiring harness , but yourcomments are reasoned, address the question, and make sense.

[Tom Hampton]

Johnny... like Dave said, the Deutsch connectors have "A", "B" and "C" molded into the housing.  I personally used grey silicone, but epoxy would work well too.  Just trying to keep water out of the sensor, and also keep the wires from shorting out on each other.  The electrical guru's of the world may have a better suggestion, but it's been working fine thus far.

 

This pic should help (protective sheathing removed)

 

 

As long as the material has a decent dielectic it should be fine.  Decent >= 500 volts / mil.  Most pure silicone meets or exceeds this standard as do most epoxies.