1001 replies to this topic

[Jim Drago]

That's a little condescending, don't you think?  We've all heard your "I hate everyone gets a trophy generation" ad nauseum. That kind of public ridicule is sure to discourage people from entering as SMSE.
 
What if all you have is a 1.6, can't afford anything else and just want a place to play with other drivers in the same boat?
 
What I really would like to see is a separate class just for those who can/want to spend six figures/season on club racing a Miata so the rest of us can have our class back. Call it "Spend Miata."

You just said the same thing? My feeling is why limit it to only 1.6 cars? There are easily as many or more NB cars that can't compete for whatever reason as well, why not let them run in this inexpensive class?

[LarryKing]

Guess what Jim. I agree with you. I've said for years now the REAL disparity is between the haves and have nots. This is not what the class was supposed to be (a drivers class, not a spenders class), but it's way too late now. A tighter rule package at the beginning might have made a difference.

 

Anywho, maybe a CSM (club SM) class for those sick of the ever raising bar could be a second chance to get it right. It would also give MPR22 a class to race his soon to be obsolete NB.

[cam]

SM is too popular it is not your class anymore, it has grown way beyond that.  

 

I suggest Chump car racing or something similar if you want lower cost wheel to wheel.  

 

Thank you for your input, your opinion is noted.

[Johnny D]

Honestly Walter SSM would be perfect for you but you have to start the class in your region.

It does cost money, that's the sport/class.
You can afford it, or you can't, or don't do it well, or do it well once in a while.

Or change class.
J~

[Jason J Ball]

SM is too popular it is not your class anymore, it has grown way beyond that.  

 

I suggest Chump car racing or something similar if you want lower cost wheel to wheel.  

 

 

So your saying this no longer applies?

 

The Spec Miata (SM) class is intended to provide the membership with the opportunity to compete in low cost, production-based cars with limited modifications, suitable for racing competition.

 

The rules are intentionally designed to be more open than the Showroom Stock class but more restricted than the Improved Touring class.

[Steve Scheifler]

42 pages to give the 1.6 the same stuff we offered it years ago and they didn't want it all so potentially 3 cars can maybe improve finishing position by one or two spots if that.... There ARE NOT tons of moth balled old race cars that are going to suddenly come out of the woodwork and start racing again....why do we continue to have this same conversation every year????

Catch up Mike. The vast majority of this has been about things which were not previously offered, some of which are about to happen. While waiting on that I revived the suspension upgrade issue just a few pages back, with predictable results (a lot of noise but primarily from those not affected).

[Johnny D]

So your saying this no longer applies?
 
The Spec Miata (SM) class is intended to provide the membership with the opportunity to compete in low cost, production-based cars with limited modifications, suitable for racing competition.
 
The rules are intentionally designed to be more open than the Showroom Stock class but more restricted than the Improved Touring class.

Absolutely not. Biggest misconception in the class.

So if Walter is looking for parity based on a lack of funds, you see how it's not going to happen.

FYI, SSM is ^^ now.
J~

[Steve Scheifler]

So your saying this no longer applies?

The Spec Miata (SM) class is intended to provide the membership with the opportunity to compete in low cost, production-based cars with limited modifications, suitable for racing competition.

The rules are intentionally designed to be more open than the Showroom Stock class but more restricted than the Improved Touring class.

No, I think he's saying that good competition breeds better competition and you can't prevent that from ending up with a huge disparity between the best and the rest. Paradise lasts only as long as it takes people to find it. (I doubt that's original but it fits. Might even be a little quantum physics in there.)

[Jim Drago]

So your saying this no longer applies?
 
The Spec Miata (SM) class is intended to provide the membership with the opportunity to compete in low cost, production-based cars with limited modifications, suitable for racing competition.
 
The rules are intentionally designed to be more open than the Showroom Stock class but more restricted than the Improved Touring class.

The class absolutely provides the membership with the opportunity to compete in low cost, production-based cars with limited modifications, suitable for racing competition..

What Steve said above...

[tom1977]

Sounds like the last 43 pages suggest leaving the class alone once and for all. It is getting very difficult to find low cost, competitive sprint racing beyond a club level. Let us not destroy what little we currently have

[Mike Collins]

It is low cost when you consider an entry level pro MX5 is $53,000 and an entry level SM is $15,000 or $25,000 if you want a turn key majors car (depending on builder and options)

[Johnny D]

Low cost and compete are relative.

I'll leave it at that.
J~

[Steve Scheifler]

It is low cost compared to pretty much any SCCA Majors class, with or without a decent level of participation. Factor in cost per second to be close and it's an absolute bargain. I don't believe anything discussed here would change that, except perhaps improve on it for those sitting on a pile of NAs.

[Steve Scheifler]

Low cost and compete are relative.

I'll leave it at that.
J~

Add up what it would cost to build a car capable of being within 1 second per minute of lap time in SM compared to any Prod or GT class. Or most any Majors class. Part of that is that these cars are slow and easy to drive, but for being competitive in a popular class at low cost, this is tops.

[Jason J Ball]

The class absolutely provides the membership with the opportunity to compete in low cost, production-based cars with limited modifications, suitable for racing competition..

What Steve said above...

 

It just seems we get relegated to second class citizens. if you don't spend $XXXXX racing, you have no right to complain. (Top Prep vs. ???) I'm willing to spend money to get closer to the front. I just end up racing less events. I'd like to have a more reliable way to make consistent power. 

 

It is low cost when you consider an entry level pro MX5 is $53,000 and an entry level SM is $15,000 or $25,000 if you want a turn key majors car (depending on builder and options)

I already have spent +$20k on my car, but its 1990 home build. Most advocate taking a significant loss (of course racing is the ultimate losing proposition) on my car and spending another $20k on a 99+ car. $20k for new car - ($9k if lucky on sale of current car) = $11k in new money

Trust me, I've already discussed building a new car with the wife. But looking at the economics of this endeavor, I could spend $5k in upgrades on my current car and have $6k left over for MORE RACING. I keep coming back to that, I'd rather race an "Inferior" car then spend $11k and 6-12 months to build a new car.   

[chris haldeman]

I agree with all the intent answers. Fact is spec Miata is cheap too participate in and that is within the intent of the class. It is just expensive too win in spec Miata. 2 very different things regaurdless of model owned.

[Johnny D]

Add up what it would cost to build a car capable of being within 1 second per minute of lap time in SM compared to any Prod or GT class. Or most any Majors class. Part of that is that these cars are slow and easy to drive, but for being competitive in a popular class at low cost, this is tops.

I'm totally with you Steve. Chance to race at some of the best tracks, priceless, etc, etc.

Ask Walter if it's low cost,

Just seeing both side.

J~

[Jim Drago]

It just seems we get relegated to second class citizens. if you don't spend $XXXXX racing, you have no right to complain. (Top Prep vs. ???) I'm willing to spend money to get closer to the front. I just end up racing less events. I'd like to have a more reliable way to make consistent power.

None of this is a rules or parity issue... If this was all a 1.6 class, all a NB class. same issues. The easy answer is to say money money money.. that is part of it, but less than 1/3 IMO. You are not buying wins in SM, no way. That is the best part about the class. i beat 60k Sm's every time I race them and I have mid 20's in my car plus labor.

[MPR22]

No, I think he's saying that good competition breeds better competition and you can't prevent that from ending up with a huge disparity between the best and the rest. Paradise lasts only as long as it takes people to find it. (I doubt that's original but it fits. Might even be a little quantum physics in there.)

Same reason that land in California is way more expensive than land in North Dakota.

[Steve Scheifler]

Same reason that land in California is way more expensive than land in North Dakota.

Yea, but I'm pretty sure Bernie has a plan to fix that.