825 replies to this topic

[speedengineer]

Heck no!  I've got an army of sensors laying around the garage from stock sensors from my s2k and miata builds and others I've accumulated.  I can re-purpose some of those temp and pressure sensors.  Other needed sensors I'll buy generic and wire in. 

 

The only AIM sensor I'm thinking about is the AIM wideband module, which appears plug n play and (I think?) CAN based, so it won't use up one of my precious analog input channels.

Also planning on doing steering angle potentiometer, brake line pressure, TPS, and MAP, and would like to install oem ABS tone rings and sensors on the 4 hubs, but probably won't due to the trouble.  Infrared tire temp sensors would be trick too, but again, probably won't.

[speedengineer]

Did a few things tonight:

 

1)  First I opened up the new Mazda piston rings and installed a couple in the stock honed bore to check end gap.  Not bad!  Must have got lucky.  The stock rings that came out were around 0.007" compression ring and 0.016" scraper.  The new rings were both at 0.008"  That'll probably open up a couple thousands after the hone, though.  Still, compared to last year, where the new mazda rings came in at 0.016" gap......

 

2)  Assembled a new toy.  I must be getting old.  A few years ago I would have said I don't need one of these.  After using it tonight, not sure how I have lived without it. 

 

3)  Removed the PPF, then the differential.  No plans to open the diff up at this point, I'll run it for a while as stock and see how it works.  Really the only reason I'm taking all this stuff out (diff, control arms will come off, knuckle, axles, etc) is that it is often EXTREMELY difficult to break this stuff loose when it's been on there for 100k miles.  It's way easier to do this in the garage on the lift than it is at the track.  So, if I happen to ever need to replace wheel bearings, or axels, or a diff, control arms, etc at the track, life will be much easier!!!

 

 

While we are on the topic of removing stuck parts, the only item I had much trouble with tonight was popping the axles out of the spindle/knuckle/hub/whatsathingy.  They are still stuck in there.  The nuts came off easy.  Can't get the axles out. Tried lots of penetrating oil, hammer, air hammer in the centerdrilled end of shaft.  Next will be a puller coupled with hammer hits, but I don't have a puller at the moment that fits.  If that doesn't work, I guess heating comes next?  Don't much like the idea of heating a part like this.  I suppose I could remove the whole knuckly thing and take it over to the press, then it'd pop out easy.  Anyone have any good tips or tricks to getting the axles out more easily than this?

Repost to the new page.  Cause I KNOW everyone is too lazy to click back to page 20 and reread.  I know I am sometimes.  haha. 

[FTodaro]

I like the transmission Jack, I have the same one. 

 

On the half Shafts. I have never had a problem getting them out with a good Air Hammer, with the pointed end. You need a good one however with a long stroke. Just let the penetrating oil work for a day or so and go at it.

 

Are you going to put in offset bushings?

 

Before you use heat i would take out the entire knuckle and press it out. I used heat once and the hub i heated up failed. 

 

Not sure it was related buy why chance it.

 

 

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[av8tor]

+1 to Frank - the air hammer did the trick for my last build, after breaking two pullers and resorting to the hyd press on my first build.  Be careful hitting the end of the axle with a steel hammer, it is easy to mushroom the end.  (I know you know that, just reminding some of the others...)  If you are in the mood for a Shakespearian comedy/tragedy and your wife has hidden your collection of classic books because they take up too much of your leisure time, go to one of the street miata forums and read all the disaster stories about removing rear axles from the spindle/knuckle/hub/thingy, funny stuff.

[Tom Hampton]

Hyd press + good rap with a hammer works for me.

[speedengineer]

I like the transmission Jack, I have the same one. 

 

On the half Shafts. I have never had a problem getting them out with a good Air Hammer, with the pointed end. You need a good one however with a long stroke. Just let the penetrating oil work for a day or so and go at it.

 

Are you going to put in offset bushings?

 

Before you use heat i would take out the entire knuckle and press it out. I used heat once and the hub i heated up failed. 

 

Not sure it was related buy why chance it.

That might be my problem, not sure my air hammer is a good one!  I'll give it one more try tonight since the penetrating oil been soaking, otherwise, press time.  That cracked hub is scary!  I had a front one crack like that.  It was aftermarket, crappy metal, thin, and no fillet radius on the backside.

 

+1 to Frank - the air hammer did the trick for my last build, after breaking two pullers and resorting to the hyd press on my first build.  Be careful hitting the end of the axle with a steel hammer, it is easy to mushroom the end.  (I know you know that, just reminding some of the others...)  If you are in the mood for a Shakespearian comedy/tragedy and your wife has hidden your collection of classic books because they take up too much of your leisure time, go to one of the street miata forums and read all the disaster stories about removing rear axles from the spindle/knuckle/hub/thingy, funny stuff.

ha! 

 

Hyd press + good rap with a hammer works for me.

That may be where I end up assuming the 'lil air hammer isn't up to the task. 

 

 

Thanks all.

[Jeff Wasilko]

I have an MXL2 in my ITA miata. It replaced a MXL that got moved to my wife's time trial miata. The hardware is great, and the software/firmware has finally matured.

 

One thing to add to your shopping list is the remote buttons interface. It will let you remotely mount buttons to interact with the dash. I'm going to be installing that module along with a wireless steering wheel button system from Summit ( http://summit-techno...ammable-version ).

 

Here's a photo of how the MXL2 looks in the stock gauge pod:

 

 

Also, pick up the Iron Canyon fuel sender adaptor and ditch the fuel gauge:

 

http://www.ironcanyo...cm-fuel-sender/

[Jeff Wasilko]

Does the MXL2 use the race studio 2 or 3? 

 

RS3 for config, RS2A for Analysis.

[Jeff Wasilko]

I know in AIM racestudio analysis you can write math channels to calculate new channels based on measured channels.  I'm not sure if these math channels can also be programmed to run live on the dash, but if so, I have a couple projects planned.  One being to calibrate a fuel tank level channel based on inputs from the fuel tank level sensor as well as the x and y accelerometer channels built into the AIM unit.  This means you could have a very accurate fuel level display regardless of what grade of paddock you're parked on.  No more need to be draining the tank and refill between sessions as many top SM teams like to do. 

 

There is limited live math channel support in the new dashes now. I use one to convert Lambda to AFR from my ECU.

 

You can look at the math channel support in RS3 to see what you can do now.

[Caveman-kwebb99]

 

 

One thing to add to your shopping list is the remote buttons interface. It will let you remotely mount buttons to interact with the dash. I'm going to be installing that module along with a wireless steering wheel button system from Summit ( http://summit-techno...ammable-version ).

 

 

 

 

 

Please send this link to Kuch, he has been looking for something to remote control his thumping stereo sounds and change stations to his favorite beats all while circling the track in his TOP PREP monster 1.6 miata!

[Tom Hampton]

Yeah, but I'd at least want oil pressure, water temp, water pressure, shift light, and wideband O2.  Ideally also want oil temp.  They add up quick.
 
Could run separate water temp and oil pressure gauges as backup, but just the $20 cheapies as they are just there in case your dash dies (unlikely).  I'll probably do something like that.

 

I did say "primary" engine monitoring, not ALL.  I only have 2 Stack gages (oil-P, H2O-T).  I use the AEM Wideband at $150 vs. the AIM unit for $399.  The 0-5V output is wired to an analog input.  But then, the AEM would use one of your analog inputs.  But, a $150 dollar premium to save an analog input seems pricey (but, I don't know how many you get).  The other inputs are sensors only and just feed the data collector. 

 

Obviously there are numerous ways to skin this cat, and no one right answer. 

 

Cheapy redundant gages is one way, but now you have multiple sensors installed in the engine plumbing (oil lines, water hoses, etc).  there is a cost for the double sensors, and minor risk of a leak at the additional penetrations. 

 

More expensive "Pro" gages is another, only one sensor to purchase and penetration is required, but they cost a little more. 

 

As this thread is somewhat cost minded, I spent a grand on my G2X system with 8 analog inputs (WidebandO2, FuelP, OilP, WaterT, brake, throttle, 2 spare), 2 "pro" gages noted above, Wideband o2, and warning lights.  Granted I have to deal with the RacePak software...but, everyone has their complaints about ever data vendor's software.  Point being, that using the "Pro" gages doesn't inherently drive the cost up to the $2k range you implied. 

 

[speedengineer]

I have an MXL2 in my ITA miata. It replaced a MXL that got moved to my wife's time trial miata. The hardware is great, and the software/firmware has finally matured.

 

One thing to add to your shopping list is the remote buttons interface. It will let you remotely mount buttons to interact with the dash. I'm going to be installing that module along with a wireless steering wheel button system from Summit ( http://summit-techno...ammable-version ).

 

Here's a photo of how the MXL2 looks in the stock gauge pod:

 

 

Also, pick up the Iron Canyon fuel sender adaptor and ditch the fuel gauge:

 

http://www.ironcanyo...cm-fuel-sender/

 

 

There is limited live math channel support in the new dashes now. I use one to convert Lambda to AFR from my ECU.

 

You can look at the math channel support in RS3 to see what you can do now.

 

Dash looks great Jeff, thanks for sharing.  Glad to hear there are some limited live math channels now, I'll check it out. 

 

ICM fuel sensor sender is neat, not cheap though.  If the new AIM dash does have sufficiently capable math channel options, I should be able to achieve similar functionality with just a few resistors and some custom equations

 

The wireless buttom setup is sweet.  But at $575 I'll pass!

[speedengineer]

Been doing some studying of the official scca CR calculation spreadsheet.  Ugh, it's got issues...wrong in a whole bunch of ways. 

https://www.scca.com...orms-procedures

 

First, if you follow the detailed instructions, you'll end up with an incorrect piston CC - it's missing a negative sign.  So, vvt motors will have a calculated CR that is way lower than actual, by like a whole CR point.  99 engines will read just a couple tenths low.  1.8NA engines will have CR measurements that come out about a half point high.  The only way to get around this error is to disobey the directions, and enter two different measurements as negative numbers. 

 

Also, the formula for calculating the piston land crevice volume is completely wrong.  Way off.  Just not a huge contributor to CR error as it's a small volume.

 

I've informed the correct person at scca and he will be working with the CRB to establish a new calculator that is simple, accurate, and used by everyone.

 

 

No wonder everybody's been shaving those VVT heads down so much...    hehe

[chris haldeman]

I've never actually used there sheet. I just put the piston down in the hole with light grease raise it alittle. Clean the excess grease out of the piston to wall clearance take a cc then raise it .500 and take a measurement too get actual piston dome volume and go from there. Accepted piston done cc is 2.5 for 99 and 5 for vvt

[speedengineer]

Yup.  I imagine it's likely that all the builders use their own calculations and arrive at the correct CR value.  But in tech during teardown....are the officials using this sheet?  That's a question that I don't know the answer to.

[Jim Drago]

Been doing some studying of the official scca CR calculation spreadsheet.  Ugh, it's got issues...wrong in a whole bunch of ways. 
https://www.scca.com...orms-procedures
 
First, if you follow the detailed instructions, you'll end up with an incorrect piston CC - it's missing a negative sign.  So, vvt motors will have a calculated CR that is way lower than actual, by like a whole CR point.  99 engines will read just a couple tenths low.  1.8NA engines will have CR measurements that come out about a half point high.  The only way to get around this error is to disobey the directions, and enter two different measurements as negative numbers. 
 
Also, the formula for calculating the piston land crevice volume is completely wrong.  Way off.  Just not a huge contributor to CR error as it's a small volume.
 
I've informed the correct person at scca and he will be working with the CRB to establish a new calculator that is simple, accurate, and used by everyone.
 
 
No wonder everybody's been shaving those VVT heads down so much...    hehe

Jason
This was pointed out to Bauer awhile back. Dan Tiley, myself and few builders were going to try and get SCCA to use one standardized sheet. right, wrong or indifferent, we wanted all to use the same sheet and know that SCCA was teching using the same sheet. Dan made a really neat one but SCCA wanted to do their own for a few reasons. Long story short, this sheet is done and I am currently using it( beta version). It should be up on SCCA site soon.
The negative through me for a loop before the Runoffs.. i never used the SCCA sheet.. when I did struggled to find the missing negative. I did know I would be under if they used that sheet though :)for the record, they did NOT use the SCCA sheet at the Runoffs.. They used the same one I was using originally, urgh!

Jim

[Tom Hampton]

Jason
This was pointed out to Bauer awhile back. Dan Tiley, myself and few builders were going to try and get SCCA to use one standardized sheet. right, wrong or indifferent, we wanted all to use the same sheet and know that SCCA was teching using the same sheet. Dan made a really neat one but SCCA wanted to do their own for a few reasons. Long story short, this sheet is done and I am currently using it( beta version). It should be up on SCCA site soon.
The negative through me for a loop before the Runoffs.. i never used the SCCA sheet.. when I did struggled to find the missing negative. I did know I would be under if they used that sheet though :)for the record, they did NOT use the SCCA sheet at the Runoffs.. They used the same one I was using originally, urgh!

Jim

I liked this post....but, only for how hilariously stupid it all sounds! 

 

 

[Todd Lamb]

The SMAC has been working with Bauer on a new spreadsheet the last couple months.

[Jim Drago]

I liked this post....but, only for how hilariously stupid it all sounds!

I had the same thoughts... the only reason I even used the SCCA sheet was because I figured that is what they would use in tech.

[speedengineer]

Jason
This was pointed out to Bauer awhile back. Dan Tiley, myself and few builders were going to try and get SCCA to use one standardized sheet. right, wrong or indifferent, we wanted all to use the same sheet and know that SCCA was teching using the same sheet. Dan made a really neat one but SCCA wanted to do their own for a few reasons. ...

Jim

 

 

The SMAC has been working with Bauer on a new spreadsheet the last couple months.

 

Good to know, guys.  Thanks. 

 

Fyi, when I talked to Bauer it sounded like he was still exploring options for this calculator to best meets their needs/requirements.  Besides being simple to use they wanted some specific features  One was the ability to utilize known piston dome cc values (like we have in SM) to save time and error cc'ing at the track, or to use traditional piston cc measurements for those engines or pistons that there is no data for.  We also talked about disregarding the piston top land crevice calculations entirely, as he felt it was too complicated and difficult to measure in a post-race tech environment.  Even though this crevice is a small part of the CR calc, I feel it should be included, especially as it potentially could prevent someone from being DQ'd as it works in the competitor's favor.  If the crevice is ignored, I think scca would need to redefine the definition of compression ratio in the GCR to not include piston crevice volume.

 

Anyway, I offered to put together a spreadsheet for him, as I was unaware at this point that Dan had already created one and that this discussion was already in progress.  Not sure how nice Dan's version is, but below is a VERY BETA copy of mine (I literally have less than two hours into it).  If you think it's got some advantages, let me know, otherwise you all can proceed with the sheet you are attempting to get approved. 

 

Jason's CR calc.  BETA.  NOT FINISHED.  NEEDS INSTRUCTIONS, AND HAS NOT YET BEEN CHECKED FOR ERRORS.

http://adrenalineaut...alc_Kohler.xlsx