187 replies to this topic

[Caveman-kwebb99]

Does anyone know of a place selling them at the $166 price?

Hoosier Midwest

[dmathias]

Anyone know a vendor for pre-heat-cycled Hoosiers, and the cost?

In my experience, the biggest problem with Hoosiers is when they do cycle-out the performance change is dramatic, old Toyos are much more forgiving than old Hoosiers.

[pat slattery]

Is it possible to heat cycle tires on a Dyno?

[Blake Thompson]

And not that I have to worry about contingency $, but those who do... I doubt Toyo will pay you Toyo bucks with Hoosier decals on your car and vice versa[/color][/font].[font="Trebuchet MS"][color="#000080"]

magnets! it will be like solonats...

[Johnny D]

Anyone know a vendor for pre-heat-cycled Hoosiers, and the cost?

In my experience, the biggest problem with Hoosiers is when they do cycle-out the performance change is dramatic, old Toyos are much more forgiving than old Hoosiers.

Yes
J~

I'm not going to run Nationals but if I did, I'd sure like this at our local shop.
http://www.tirerack....e.jsp?techid=66

Is someone going to start a DIY thread on how to make one?

J~

[FTodaro]

Can someone help me understand the "it's cheaper argument"? $148+15 shaving = 163/toyo. At $166/Hoosier, the difference is hardly worth mentioning. If they are supposed to last longer, maybe that's where the savings are. Though I've never run on Hoosiers, I'd always thought that Hoosiers and "lasting long" don't go together in the same sentence.

Its a question of buying more sets of tires per season, not the difference between the cost comparison to one set of tires.

[AJ Roderick]

Does anyone know of a place selling them at the $166 price?

Aaron Quine @ stupidfasttires.com can also get them for that price

[Den]

Denny, the only one I know of is Tirerack.

Although Tirerack sells the whole Hoosier R6/A6 line up and I have asked if they sell or might get to sell the SM6 I was told that because Hoosier requires their dealers to provide track support they weren't allowed to. Just yesterday I asked again thinking/hoping that due to the increases in volume for Hoosier they might have changed their policy towards Tirerack but got the same answer as before.

I then contacted Hoosier and related my tale of woe as a racer that only ever has one set of tires and no extra track days and how was I supposed to follow the Hoosier heat cycle process. Told him as far as I know Tirerack is the only dealer that will send you heat cycled tires. He went on to say that well, as long as you can give them a couple of hours or so after the first running they should react favorably (pretty much TS to me) then why don't they recommend that in writing. Although I told him I wasn't happy, he didn't care! I pointed out to him that it wasn't very consistent to allow Tirerack to sell the whole line without providing track support but hold back on giving them SM6 to sell but, but, like I said they're the boss and I'm not!

[Johnny D]

From the Hoosiers site under the SM6 tire, there's "Tire Care Tips" and more.

Tire Break-In Procedure
Proper break-in will not affect initial performance but will increase the competitive life of the tire.

The procedure can be broken down into phases.

1st phase: The initial run
2nd phase: The length of the time the tire is allowed to "cure"

The Initial Run Heat Cycle

R6 Roadrace

The first laps for the tire are critical for setting up the durability and competitive life. The first session should consist of no more than 10-15 minutes of running. The early part of the session should be run at an easy pace, with the speed gradually increased until the end of the session. The final lap should be run at the fastest possible speed. The intent is to achieve maximum tire temp on the last lap. At this point the car should be brought in and the tires allowed to cool at a normal rate.

During the initial run-in process, the inflation pressure should be 3-5 psi higher than you would normally use. The best progression would have the driver taking 4-7 laps to accomplish this break-in. Each lap should be approximately 7-10 seconds a lap faster than the previous lap. The goal is to have the tire temp as high as possible on the last lap without "shocking" the tire during the warm up laps. In essence, no wheelspin, late braking, or sliding. The last lap should be at, or very close, the maximum possible.

J~

[Rob Burgoon]

We should have a contest to see who can execute the most perfect break in during the morning warmup

[ChrisA]

Most folks I've talked with say the TireRack type of heat-cycling is pretty much worthless. Run them on the track a session and then switch them out and let them sit for a day or more.

[Johnny D]

Ya, I'm thinking 6~8 min warm up on whatever new tire, NASCAR pit stop and go back out on what tires I'm going to Qual on, in whatever time I have left to get to temp and then set.

Even easier if you're only breaking in one set and running to classes.
J~

[Jim Boemler]

Sounds like there's no such thing as a practice session anymore, we just have time for tire scrubbing. How many guys have enough crew to do hot-pit tire changes on a regular basis?

[Jim Drago]

Sounds like there's no such thing as a practice session anymore, we just have time for tire scrubbing. How many guys have enough crew to do hot-pit tire changes on a regular basis?

JB
That is no different what most do on Toyos now? I take a new set of Toyos out session one on test day, scrub them, let them sit until Sunday, qualify and race with them? I am so excited that there is a PDX the week before the Runoffs here in Memphis as I can scrub three sets of Toyos and actual practice on my $450 test day at Road America, for both of my twenty minute traffic filled sessions.

One other thing, unfortunately many are offering Hoosier advice or finding are in great Lakes, If that experience is at Mid Ohio, I think it is worthless. It is a one off.
What I think we are seeing... If you run new Toyos at Mid Ohio, they will absolutely grain and be destroyed in a few sessions. Most either know this or don't buy many new tires, so they show up with the correct tire by accident. While I have not run Hoosiers there, imagine from general knowledge and track experience, you could shred a new Hoosier just as easily, maybe more so. But in any event, YOU HAVE TO CYCLE WHATEVER TIRE YOU RUN AT MID OHIO.

Jim

[Johnny D]

I didn't know this process and think some others didn't either.
I'm going to do it but I'm not running a new set for every race so I'll be done for a while.
I don't have any crew so it a PITA but I'm not doing a track day so I gotta do what I gotta do.
It will save me money in the long run I'll do it.

Unless SCCA lets us run in another run group, knowing that we're going to come off track after a few laps,
Pretty please SCCA

It's sad that the guy on a budget that only has one set, not knowing this, maybe screwing them up and have s shorter tire life because he has to use them next.
J~

[Sphinx]

The best progression would have the driver taking 4-7 laps to accomplish this break-in. Each lap should be approximately 7-10 seconds a lap faster than the previous lap. The goal is to have the tire temp as high as possible on the last lap without "shocking" the tire during the warm up laps. In essence, no wheelspin, late braking, or sliding. The last lap should be at, or very close, the maximum possible.

J~

Now, that's funny! So, drivers will be any where from 28 to 70 seconds per lap slower on their first lap to work up to this progression. Asking the SM crowd to exercise that kind of patience on track is kinda funny. Most guys I know are driving 10-10ths by the end of the 1st lap around the track, sticker tires or not.

[Jim Boemler]

JB
That is no different what most do on Toyos now? I take a new set of Toyos out session one on test day, scrub them, let them sit until Sunday, qualify and race with them?

For those with a trailer full of tires, and money enough to do test days just to heat up their tires, that makes sense. Well, except for Hoosier wanting the tires to sit for a WEEK -- that implies you don't get to use the tires scrubbed on Friday until the NEXT race, which means buying (and carrying) another set of tires.

I think we're seeing a difference in mindset, between the Eastern National-focused drivers, and the Western Regional guys. If the Nationals are ever held in the West again, maybe that mindset will spread out here.

[Johnny D]

And we get the Bozo that goes off and we get a FCC.
There's always newbies, maybe they will feel good about passing us.
Your call, Track day, Tirerack, or use them up faster.
J~

[Jim Boemler]

Now, that's funny! So, drivers will be any where from 28 to 70 seconds per lap slower on their first lap to work up to this progression. Asking the SM crowd to exercise that kind of patience on track is kinda funny. Most guys I know are driving 10-10ths by the end of the 1st lap around the track, sticker tires or not.

+1 -- at 28 seconds down, I'd probably get black-flagged.

[Steve D]

Most guys I know are driving 10-10ths by the end of pit lane on the out lap, sticker tires or not.

Fixed it for ya.