82 replies to this topic

[Johnny D]

Ok, I'll tell, SCCA did this on purpose to lull you into a false sence of security about tech for the Runoffs.  

J~

[Jim Drago]

Jim, why wouldn't an ECU check be on your list?

 

We can add that to the list, a little harder to do as it needs to be sent to Topeka. but I'll add it as well... 

 

However, it doesn't change this sentence any...

 that wouldn't do much and there are MANY who could field a car that would pass all of that easily and still have a substantial advantage on the field. 

[KyleLoustaunau]

I think a piss test should also be on that list. ( I heard Mark has been using PED's)

[Jim Drago]

I think a piss test should also be on that list. ( I heard Mark has been using PED's)

 

D's maybe , not sure on the PE part though

[Joe (dad) Jordan]

This is coming from a 1.6 team and we had an off weekend, the cars have never been as close as they are now especially the last 2 majors,  there are no cars that have more power than the others.  It's totally dependent on the type of corner and which car is fastest....the 99 the 01 a 1.8NA or a 1.6.  (Gear rpm and type of corner are contributing factors)

 

I do believe that doing the tech  list that Jim has listed would be a good start to scare those that may be straying.  I for one don't think the top 15 in the west are and have not seen any car stick out in the power department mid or back pack like sometimes happens.  I do not sit in the car anymore, but have a pretty good eye from this vantage point.

 

I have had plenty of people insinuate that we are cheating and to me that is a barometer of how fast you are.....This last weekend we were off the pace so did not get any of those snide comments  ,..... at Thunderhill heard it a plenty     The old saying goes...IF YOU ARE NOT PISSING SOMEONE OFF YOU ARE NOT GOING FAST ENOUGH!

[Bench Racer]

We can add that to the list, a little harder to do as it needs to be sent to Topeka. but I'll add it as well... 

 

However, it doesn't change this sentence any...

 that wouldn't do much and there are MANY who could field a car that would pass all of that easily and still have a substantial advantage on the field. 

Hard is good, ah, yer to young to know about soft.

Don't disagree with your, "MANY who could field a car" statement, if were making a list, make a completet list where advantages can be gained. Trust me if some low end torque could be mapped for my 1.6, it'd be done and I wouldn't be talking about it. Please note I didn't suggest open inspection of any mechanical stuff that's not on the list. If someone is selling blueprinted rear axles for $200.00 and there is reduced friction, we all know there is much more to be gained inside the transmission.

 

How about some help with my OBD not functioning or better yet help with the issue I have posted in another thread. Ya-all remember the thread a while ago about mentoring new folks that come to Spec Miata, how about mentoring an old folk that's been here a while.

[Mark Drennan]

KyleLoustaunau, on 29 Apr 2014 - 12:26 PM, said:

I think a piss test should also be on that list. ( I heard Mark has been using PED's)

D's maybe , not sure on the PE part though

 

LOL

[Jim Drago]

That's awesome!

[Craig Berry]

Just catching up with this thread, thought I was looking at a SE or SW thread, not West Coast. I do not want to discount that there may always be some that will cheat to win, but I have found that most of the time the people at the front just put all the pieces together. It is also very natural and easy to think that there is "No Way" someone can go that much faster legally. That is the easy out.

Personally my car, and my teammates car have been massively torn down many times, so have many other front runners with OPM, Autotechnik, Advanced, and I am sure others, with no DQ's as far as I know. I am always relieved when there is an invasive tech process. This validates the hard work and 30 yrs of racing (spending $)

I guess bottom line is that even if it were possible to Dyno the cars to the exact same number, put the same set up on all, same air pressure.....someone is going to be faster than someone else.....with this class on any given weekend, track, weather conditions, your head, your prep....on and on you will get beat and you will wonder why. I think the answer is not Always that someone has more power or cheating.

Thats my 2, and I am ready to get to the west coast! Drennan......, Drago and I are still waiting on track notes!

[Craig Berry]

Forget all I said above and go with the Ricky Bobby video.....Says it all!

[Caveman-kwebb99]

 

How about some help with my OBD not functioning or better yet help with the issue I have posted in another thread. Ya-all remember the thread a while ago about mentoring new folks that come to Spec Miata, how about mentoring an old folk that's been here a while.

 

 

UNMENTORABLE 

[KyleLoustaunau]

That was probably the best post in mazdaracers history. Atta boy Mark.

[Charlie Hayes]

Using that video to answer anything is always prime.

[Bench Racer]

UNMENTORABLE 

If you have knowledge relative to the issue with my car, please impart that knowledge here http://mazdaracers.c...ard-diagnostic/  other wise STFU.

[Jamz14]

WOO HOO!!! We must be getting faster as recently someone gently suggested we were cheating!!!!!!!

 

Look, people are skirting the rules. Everyone up and down the grid knows it. But no one is getting away for long with big power mods. That becomes too evident and the major players will never allow that to go on for long. It is the accumulation of tiny things that are adding up to put guys in that 130 range. They call that car "developed". I once said to a friend here on the forums that I felt our car was one of the better "developed" cars on the west coast. I was an idiot. Not even close. There are far more developed cars on the west coast than our POS 97. Our car will never be one of the top prepped cars, quite frankly, we just do not have the budget to accurately dyno 10 different air filters, engine oils, bin match, flow countless heads intakes exhausts, ETC. You want the truth? That is what it takes. In the hands of a fair driver, a car that is prepped to that level will compete at the front quite often. BUT!! I will tell everyone what our secret is to compete close to the front, and maybe with some luck stand on the podium against some excellent drives. You ready for it??????? Setup. I have been lucky enough to be counseled by some good people here on how to setup the car. I am lucky enough to have the tolerance for pain and misery to comitt myself to learning the setup and willing to put in the time at the track to make changes that are quite frankly a total pain in the ass to do. With a decent car and a willingness to do setup before EVERY track event that counts, we can win sometimes. Don't want to do this? No problem, there is still a way that you can win sometimes. PAY one of the top shops to provide you with an engine, trans and a car that takes advantage of the years of knowledge they have collected in "developing" the car and makes great power. Then you have a chance of being at the front too even as a mediocre driver. If you do both, you have a chance of being a multiple runoff winner. There is no other way.

 

Setup is the difference for us this last year. I thank the people that have helped me realize that (you know who you are). In a car that is not fighting you, you can do amazing things with it against cars with 10 fold the amount of money we have in ours. But it isn't good enough to get close on the setup. It needs to be precise and replicable. You know how easy it is to be off a half or full % on cross? And if you are off a 1/2 % on cross in the wrong direction........... forget it. The car might as well be undrivable now for us.

 

And Bench, it isn't the kids that need the mentoring. At least out here they are kicking everyones behind. It is the older guys that think they are missing bolt on power that need the mentoring. The kids will take an avergae car and beat most peoples butt with it. They have an advantage the other guys don't. They lack fear and a concept of money. They don't need any other additional advantages that mentoring would provide.

 

Well enough words for the month. I know Ron and Jims heads are smoking with just looking at something over 1 paragraph. Damn drivers

[Ron Alan]

WOO HOO!!! We must be getting faster as recently someone gently suggested we were cheating!!!!!!!
 
Look, people are skirting the rules. Everyone up and down the grid knows it. But no one is getting away for long with big power mods. That becomes too evident and the major players will never allow that to go on for long. It is the accumulation of tiny things that are adding up to put guys in that 130 range. They call that car "developed". I once said to a friend here on the forums that I felt our car was one of the better "developed" cars on the west coast. I was an idiot. Not even close. There are far more developed cars on the west coast than our POS 97. Our car will never be one of the top prepped cars, quite frankly, we just do not have the budget to accurately dyno 10 different air filters, engine oils, bin match, flow countless heads intakes exhausts, ETC. You want the truth? That is what it takes. In the hands of a fair driver, a car that is prepped to that level will compete at the front quite often. BUT!! I will tell everyone what our secret is to compete close to the front, and maybe with some luck stand on the podium against some excellent drives. You ready for it??????? Setup. I have been lucky enough to be counseled by some good people here on how to setup the car. I am lucky enough to have the tolerance for pain and misery to comitt myself to learning the setup and willing to put in the time at the track to make changes that are quite frankly a total pain in the ass to do. With a decent car and a willingness to do setup before EVERY track event that counts, we can win sometimes. Don't want to do this? No problem, there is still a way that you can win sometimes. PAY one of the top shops to provide you with an engine, trans and a car that takes advantage of the years of knowledge they have collected in "developing" the car and makes great power. Then you have a chance of being at the front too even as a mediocre driver. If you do both, you have a chance of being a multiple runoff winner. There is no other way.
 
Setup is the difference for us this last year. I thank the people that have helped me realize that (you know who you are). In a car that is not fighting you, you can do amazing things with it against cars with 10 fold the amount of money we have in ours. But it isn't good enough to get close on the setup. It needs to be precise and replicable. You know how easy it is to be off a half or full % on cross? And if you are off a 1/2 % on cross in the wrong direction........... forget it. The car might as well be undrivable now for us.
 
And Bench, it isn't the kids that need the mentoring. At least out here they are kicking everyones behind. It is the older guys that think they are missing bolt on power that need the mentoring. The kids will take an avergae car and beat most peoples butt with it. They have an advantage the other guys don't. They lack fear and a concept of money. They don't need any other additional advantages that mentoring would provide.
 
Well enough words for the month. I know Ron and Jims heads are smoking with just looking at something over 1 paragraph. Damn drivers

You have come a long way grasshopper in a short time!
What's funny is you are now preaching to the choir and not bitching from the cheap seats...welcome

But to all those that are still figuring it all out I will give them some hope and take one thing you said down a notch. When it comes to a Major or the Runoffs, it will take a great driver, great car,great setup and tires to win. A great driver with good car/setup will still finish well depending on the depth of the field. But a fair driver in a great car will not compete in a field of great drivers.

And I'm of the opinion that these cars have a pretty big sweet spot when it comes to set up. I say this because I've seen great drivers put down times within tenths of their fastest times with very sub optimal set ups. Generally this occurs after a little contact during a race be it wall or competitor. Recently a slide across uneven pavement surfaces resulted in a front left wheel that was 7/8's toed out with 0 degrees camber in a very good drivers car. Though right turns weren't optimal he could turn left like a mad man! In a Major race he still managed to hold position and finish running lap times not very far off his best in the race.

In the end...work on the nut behind the wheel first. Then worry about how to cheat up your car like everyone else

[Bench Racer]

 

And Bench, it isn't the kids that need the mentoring. At least out here they are kicking everyones behind. It is the older guys that think they are missing bolt on power that need the mentoring. The kids will take an avergae car and beat most peoples butt with it. They have an advantage the other guys don't. They lack fear and a concept of money. They don't need any other additional advantages that mentoring would provide.

 

Jamz14, I do like that 14 number. This guy doesn't require mentoring to understand the capability of kids. In 1991 when I started Karting two of the first folks meet were Neno (dad) and Niki Coello (9 year old kid). Niki raced in the 100cc Junior class at 275 pounds and I in Senior Sportsman at 325 pounds. Pre qualifying both classes practiced together. If something was slightly off with Niki's Kart we had fun. Only way I stay close. Niki has gone on to some pretty impressive SCCA FC and Spec Miata/Spec Miata Pro series drives along with F2000 in a Pro series. I also watched Danica grow as a driver since Karting along with Hornish. 

Since Road America is no longer the Runoffs track life is good/not so good for the 1.6 at other tracks. The not so good for the 1.6 is tracks or race conditions that require racing below 5,000 rpm. 

The mentoring I previously mentioned for folks new to Spec Miata was a page torn out of a thread someone started a while ago. The thread died and it was not aimed at kids. I'm perfectly happy with my car, the driver maybe not. Off line people make comments that people my age shouldn't be racing a car, my reponse, I'm not racing, I'm legally driving fast.    I have a ten year old grand daughter with mostly zero interest in Karting, sits in the Miata now and then sometimes with a veary large grin, maybe there are some thoughts within her.

[Caveman-kwebb99]

If you have knowledge relative to the issue with my car, please impart that knowledge here http://mazdaracers.c...ard-diagnostic/  other wise STFU.

If you have knowledge relative to the issue with my car, please impart that knowledge here http://mazdaracers.c...ard-diagnostic/  other wise STFU.

BM...

[john mueller]

My trolling turned into a WHY DON'T WE HAVE MORE TECH thread, which is good.

 

I can work within NASA to develop a repeatable process (region -to-region) but I have no idea if SCCA's equivalent (SMAC) has the ability to make such changes...  If SMAC does I'd be willing to work with them to develop a program that would bridge between the two organizations so no matter where a SM driver runs they'd have an idea what to expect and what should be at a minimum happening post session.

 

Hell yes this would it be really hard to do (especially since a few members of SMAC dislike me   ), but IMO the pain would worth it for the class.

[Jim Drago]

SMAC has zero to do with tech, zero influence on what gets teched.