856 replies to this topic

[FTodaro]

hold your breath. you never know what could happen next.

 

Are we past the three year moratorium on plate and weight changes? 

 

We will need another 30 plus page thread on those changes.

[Steve Scheifler]

Kyle, I respect your opinion and your choice, and especially your honesty, but help me to understand why 50 pounds is a deal breaker for you.

[Glenn]

 

 

establish a “Regional-only” class, dubbed SM1 in addition to the regular Spec Miata class.

Hell we invented that class a long time ago, we called it SMC, c for cheat.  Rules were you needed to have a minimum number of cheats or you were assessed $$ penalties for noncompliance......ah the fun you can have drinking Pepe Pombo's Tequila.........

[Tom Sager]

I don't like your math, Steve.     50 pounds might compensate for a small power advantage but you're handicapping handling too much also.  

[Caveman-kwebb99]

I think we should name it smC for spec miata cheaters oh boy thats a trophy to be sought after right there.

[Johnny D]

For 1, isn't the season over for most, so you don't have anything to bitch about for a while ??

 

If not, then you have one race?

I suggest..

https://www.youtube....h?v=yeRSksvG9E0

 

J~

[Craig Berry]

I may be off base, but one problem would be how do you know for sure if you add wt or not, or what class to run, and if your competitors actually know what class to run? It appears that most who have posted are 100% sure they are compliant and would have passed the scrutiny of the Runoffs. Again I will submit that my team arrogantly felt the same way. I am wondering out loud how many cars, not just in that race, but around the country would have passed? We will never know, but to assume that all cars checked failed in some way is just a strange coincidence is short sighted.
As Ron would say, my 2 cents, which is worth nothing

[Caveman-kwebb99]

Steve I know u r just trying to propose solutions...

I race sm for the incredible close competition but 50 pounds is a pretty good hadicap

Its an 8hr drive a 3 day stay tires entry fee fuel amongat other things to then be handicapped I just personally its a waiat of resources for me and many others to take the handicap or race in the cheater class.

I hope the event goes well I love the arrc... My favorite race of the year but my decision has been made now.

Also maybe we can make another class called smCC for those who have to many Cc's as there is no way in hell all those cars will be fixed before arrc, a few will be of course.

Where was Lisa noble on a press release after daytona? And let me tell you on the 01+ cars there is a 2+HP and tq. Advantage...

[Tom Sager]

I see no reason why SCCA can't sort this out in an afternoon.  Leave the rule as it is unless there is a case to be made that the practice by some of the engine builders is justified.  If so, change the rule but I haven't read anything in 40 pages that tries to make that case.  

[Steve Scheifler]

I don't like your math, Steve. 50 pounds might compensate for a small power advantage but you're handicapping handling too much also.

I don't disagree Tom, at least as a long-term fix, but I think it should be somewhat punitive in the short-term to satsify those who rightfully feel there should be some price paid while still allowing all to race reasonably competitively if they want to. But I just want to push the concept, perhaps 35 is better. I think 20 is too little.

[Rob Burgoon]

Sure, but that doesn't change regardless, unless your point is that this gives them a chance to make up points in some regional championships they lost all season. I wonder how many people in contention for such a thing will run the alternate class because they think they may be non-compliant. Seems like a stretch, but if you give them weight and let them stay are they much more likely to comply? I would think so.

 

 

 

Let's say it's a driver called Ken95.  Ken95 is in a regional points race with Racer X.  Racer X asked for a runoffs legal Drago engine and ran it all season.  Ken is trailing 10 points to Racer X.  Racer X is worried his legal engine might not be legal, but doesn't care enough about the regional points race to change heads since he thinks the rules will change for 2015.  Ken95 knows this.  Racer X was going to stay home, until the region said he could come play if he ran with 20lbs.  Ken95 has a meltdown as he feels any additional lead for Racer X should be delivered in 180 gr increments.

 

Blah blah... this is a work of fiction.  Any resemblance to persons living or dead is entirely coincidence....

[Caveman-kwebb99]

holy cow bargoondy you actually have a sense of humor.  

[Rob Burgoon]

The XXlbs bonus weight makes more sense for a one off special event like NASA Champs.

[Caveman-kwebb99]

I think maybe we need a new thread on here call CA "Cheaters Annonymous" were we can hold on line meetings.

 

I will go first " I am a Cheater" I have the dreaded STR or RTS or whatever they call it, if you get too close to me you could catch the disease.

 

I find it hillarious I am about the only one who has the balls to even say that my car is now non compliant when there are hundres if not a thousand out there that are from either CC or SRT or BOTH...

[Johnny D]

Isn't if you all are non compliant you have a equal class ??

J~

[Jamz14]

Just being pragmatic, you need to think of the 80/20 rule of things.  Some people will always cheat, most will get caught eventually.  It is the way of things.  It is our job as an active community to shun a known INTENTIONAL cheaters and make them feel uncomfortable and unwelcome.

...

Shunning "intentional" cheaters huh?

 

So now we assemble a jury to bring them to trial and convict them of intentional cheating and banish them from the kingdom. Would you have these latest drivers booted? Do you accept their word that they didn't do it intentionally? Do you go with the insinuations of some here that they were intentionally cheating? Are you the judge of "intentional"? How about customers that bought these? Boot them too? How about drivers that might have asked for extra? How is it that you are going to determine "intentional".

 

Banish me from the kingdom then. I want no part of this type of thing. Is my engine legal, hell yes!!! But do I push the gray as much as I can outside the engine.....yes. Hell, here on this forum you could purchase a "speed secret". I'll come clean and tell you about one of my little "cheats" that I intentionally did and do. Protest me all you want.

 

On the 97 at least, the wiring harness runs right in front of the snorkle. A 1" diameter blockage right in front of the intake. So I pushed the wiring harness underneath the snorkle. I moved a stock part from its original location 1" away in order to pick up the air intake the way it is supposed to be. I didn't move the entire harness. I move a 3 " section 1 " away from the stock location. I also have relays that aren't mounted up to their stock bracket. They are just hanging in the engine compartment. Another cheat you can banish me for.

 

These people have been punished. Many may have been punished beyond their culpability. Entire seasons have been screwed up. Hasn't everyone paid a high enough price? Let it go!! The process worked and everyone has their pint of blood. The rules are clear, if you want to build a compaint head you can without changing the head builders tools. If a builder can't make the plunge without violating, then the plunge doesn't get made. But at least some head builders can make the plunge cut without blending and deburring. Everything worked here as intended!!!!! The rules, the protest format, the punishment. The idea of shunning should be shunned and banished.

 

And this doesn't even take into account young drivers trying to make a career. I know all us old guys might be bitter about not being able to make a career out of driving. And as much as all y'all saying this is amateur fun racing, there are young talented drivers trying to use this as a launching pad for careers. What are these young guys supposed to do when they have an extremely limited amount of time to make it and they are going up against some of the best builders and drivers in the world? Sit back for years and not push the gray areas while everyone around them does? Again the processed worked. The solution in my opinion is to use the process more!!!!! I made a suggestion because someone said that there were a lack of suggestions. I saw not one response to that suggestion.

 

Let it go. Get prepped for next season. Go have some fun. F*&%ing eh, you guys get to be race car drivers for christ sakes. Isn't that enough? I know plenty of people that would give anything to be in your guys ( and ladys ) shoes. And I know some guys that want to be in lady shoes.

[Johnny D]

Shunning "intentional" cheaters huh?

 

So now we assemble a jury to bring them to trial and convict them of intentional cheating and banish them from the kingdom. Would you have these latest drivers booted? Do you accept their word that they didn't do it intentionally? Do you go with the insinuations of some here that they were intentionally cheating? Are you the judge of "intentional"? How about customers that bought these? Boot them too? How about drivers that might have asked for extra? How is it that you are going to determine "intentional".

 

Banish me from the kingdom then. I want no part of this type of thing. Is my engine legal, hell yes!!! But do I push the gray as much as I can outside the engine.....yes. Hell, here on this forum you could purchase a "speed secret". I'll come clean and tell you about one of my little "cheats" that I intentionally did and do. Protest me all you want.

 

On the 97 at least, the wiring harness runs right in front of the snorkle. A 1" diameter blockage right in front of the intake. So I pushed the wiring harness underneath the snorkle. I moved a stock part from its original location 1" away in order to pick up the air intake the way it is supposed to be. I didn't move the entire harness. I move a 3 " section 1 " away from the stock location. I also have relays that aren't mounted up to their stock bracket. They are just hanging in the engine compartment. Another cheat you can banish me for.

 

These people have been punished. Many may have been punished beyond their culpability. Entire seasons have been screwed up. Hasn't everyone paid a high enough price? Let it go!! The process worked and everyone has their pint of blood. The rules are clear, if you want to build a compaint head you can without changing the head builders tools. If a builder can't make the plunge without violating, then the plunge doesn't get made. But at least some head builders can make the plunge cut without blending and deburring. Everything worked here as intended!!!!! The rules, the protest format, the punishment. The idea of shunning should be shunned and banished.

 

And this doesn't even take into account young drivers trying to make a career. I know all us old guys might be bitter about not being able to make a career out of driving. And as much as all y'all saying this is amateur fun racing, there are young talented drivers trying to use this as a launching pad for careers. What are these young guys supposed to do when they have an extremely limited amount of time to make it and they are going up against some of the best builders and drivers in the world? Sit back for years and not push the gray areas while everyone around them does? Again the processed worked. The solution in my opinion is to use the process more!!!!! I made a suggestion because someone said that there were a lack of suggestions. I saw not one response to that suggestion.

 

Let it go. Get prepped for next season. Go have some fun. F*&%ing eh, you guys get to be race car drivers for christ sakes. Isn't that enough? I know plenty of people that would give anything to be in your guys ( and ladys ) shoes. And I know some guys that want to be in lady shoes.

 

Glad you're feeling better, almost a page.

J~

[RussMcB]

Has the SCCA said yet when competitors will get a chance for input?  I'm concerned they (HQ) feel the need to offer a solution ASAP, and may make the decision they think is best for the class (and their decision might not be what many think is right).

 

A decision is easier to accept if you feel like you've had a chance to comment before the decision is made.

[Jamz14]

Johnny, if you think for a minute that I am feeling better. You don't know me or my son. I have something I'd like to say to you right about now.

[Johnny D]

Has the SCCA said yet when competitors will get a chance for input?  I'm concerned they (HQ) feel the need to offer a solution ASAP, and may make the decision they think is best for the class (and their decision might not be what many think is right).

 

A decision is easier to accept if you feel like you've had a chance to comment before the decision is made.

 

Are you proposing they propose it ??

J~