199 replies to this topic

[Andrew Charbonneau]

YES i will get back to you let me finish my coffee

[Andrew Charbonneau]

No danny I think im done talking about this and talking to you if you cant figure it out , im sure alot of other people are too in the souteast.
you stareded this with your little drive bye shooting and you comments were light .

[Jim Drago]

VIR sounds like it will be a lot of .... uh .. uh .. uh ... "fun"?

[High Chair]

VIR sounds like it will be a lot of .... uh .. uh .. uh ... "fun"?

It should be a good time!! I am bringing a new front bumper and a back up car.

[Cliff Brown USMC]

One would have thought this would have ended by now so I will try and thread the needle and make everyone's point for them.Its great that we can get this in the open but at times some of the posts are petty and others just plain comical ( A.C.)

1.Danny Steyn is considered by others an instigator since he had no blood in the fight and started this post.In certain circles he is disliked for his dry, warped humor that most dont understand it. I do. No problem there. I believe Danny's point was what happened was unsafe, avoidable and it brought discredit upon our Spec Miata class as we want more drivers young and old to enter and play with us, not to be afraid or weary that we are suicidal maniacs and put people in the wall for fun or accidental. This was a rare, hopefully once a year incident that will not be repeated again. To all who have participated or read the forums I assure you we are professional, respectful and solid drivers from the S.E. We welcome everyone from all over the US and we bend over backwards to help you out, help you learn the track and provide parts to keep you going in time of need.We want you to come here and race with us. I think we are the most competitive region in the US with tons of talent. This incident may have been a black eye but I assure you we are a first class group and can hang with anyone, anywhere.

2. Voytec was blocking. More than once. I will not say he got what he deserved but I will say with certainty he will not do it again unless he is Plum Nuts. If he does, HE will get what he deserves. He does not have to come on here to defend himself nor should he.We will talk to him in person next time we all see him. Nuff said.It's over.He is on the radar.

3. Jeff Labounty is well respected and has helped numerous drivers and others in time of need. Jeff on the track is a different animal. He is the Dale Earnhardt of Miata's. LOL. Jeff is a very fair driver and has always raced 90% clean. He only gets out of hand when he is cut off, blocked, ( more than once) screwed up or you / they became aggressive. Once you show him disrespect or any of the things mentioned it's game on, no holds barred full contact circle track racing. I know this is not circle track but this is where he comes from. Point is don't cheat, cut off or be blatant and you will have no problems. Jeff actually does what I only think about doing or wanting to do but my discipline comes in and stops me.There are many times I have wanted to return a favor and we all are guilty of it.I also do not think that, had he had a second to think about it, he would have chose a different method with Voyteck or place. I was not there so I cannot state what actually happened and neither can any of you with 100% certainty. Jeff, Andrew, Danny, Voytec,Sparks, Pombo, Clements, Drago and all others are my friends. I think my assessment of Jeff is true and non biased.Yes he has had many incidents and just look at the videos. He does not give you one inch. You have to earn every one.If you think he is wrong, protest him or bring it up to the stewards that day. Don't wait to post the complaints here. That is Monday Morning Quarterback and Voytec DID NOT do a complaint.My feelings are if the parties involved do not do the paperwork who are we to question them?

4. Nate Sparks. Maybe you misunderstood me. I think you are a hell of a driver and I want you in this class for years to come. I think the better you get that you will leave us and move up to the pro's in a few years. You are a clean driver and I will race you anytime. Just be patient dealing with the old folks and their walkers. See you on the next race, No hard feelings at all.

5. Andrew Von Charbonaugh. Guys, I apologize for his lack of spelling grammar, his weird, comical videos, to Danny for calling you 133 times in one night being a pest, to the announcers at the Run offs for having to say " All jacked up on Mountain Dew Andrew C.", for being an instigator on very damn subject known to man and finally to his wife. We warned her. He is one warped, strange man and we have tried to wind him in. It's hopeless. After all, he's the champ until October so let him have his fun. He is 90% full of $%^&.

6. Dave College and others. I am sorry that I have to use my friend as an example. Rumors at the track say your car is either cheated up, on fuel or both. I never accused you of cheating and I believe you are innocent until proven guilty.I think that if those who are saying your car is cheated up and they do not protest the next time I will give up their names as they lack balls to actually go and do the papers. I do know that the others will be taking a hard look at you and some other drivers with really strong engines and I assure you that they will protest you if you or anyone else is showing impressive results. If you are complying and you are driving that well, there are a lot of people that will owe you an explanation and a retraction. We only want all the drivers reading this to know we want a fair, no fueled, not cheated up race among our peers. And Dave, if you have improved to compete against Drago, Charbonaugh, Sandlin and Van Vurst. Hats off to you. Good job.I am still trying to beat them.

7. It's easy for all of us to blame others and show video to prove a point. A video only shows a one sided partial view of tunnel vision. To make the point. Have you looked at the football reviews and shown one angle and it looks very convincing. But another camera angle shows something that the first totally missed and contradicts the first. Strange how that works but it is true. It shows that you cannot see everything and that in fractions of a second you have a nano second to implement a choice. I am amazed we do this well at the speed, turns, pace and cars involved.

To put this subject to an end. I say let's learn from this and in the future do what is required by us all. If you are involved in an incident with another driver, either go talk to him personally or file a protest.If you do neither take you wine and go home. Don't post you bitching here. You will be called out for it. If you think someone is cheating, protest them and put them into the stewards realm. If he cheated then shame on him. If he did not and he is clean, go up to him and say your sorry, no hard feelings, I was wrong. You should never be ashamed to ask to have a car protested if you REASONABLY think they are cheating.This should be standard practice and should happen to at least one car every race weekend. If it will break the ice, protest my car next race. Break that SOB all the way down. I will not be mad, I will be happy as long as I get out by 7 : ). That way everyone knows my car is clean and we can go to the next one. Protesting is not disrespect. It is keeping all of us HONEST and a badge of honor and courage. I will give away patches to those that do protests and win it. The more protests the better. So, Let's show some nads and let those mechanics earn their money. Who here would be offended if they were protested by their fellow racer or friend? Not me. I welcome it.
Semper Fi!

[Jim Drago]

One would have thought this would have ended by now so I will try and thread the needle and make everyone's point for them.Its great that we can get this in the open but at times some of the posts are petty and others just plain comical ( A.C.)

1.Danny Steyn is considered by others an instigator since he had no blood in the fight and started this post.In certain circles he is disliked for his dry, warped humor that most dont understand it. I do. No problem there. I believe Danny's point was what happened was unsafe, avoidable and it brought discredit upon our Spec Miata class as we want more drivers young and old to enter and play with us, not to be afraid or weary that we are suicidal maniacs and put people in the wall for fun or accidental. This was a rare, hopefully once a year incident that will not be repeated again. To all who have participated or read the forums I assure you we are professional, respectful and solid drivers from the S.E. We welcome everyone from all over the US and we bend over backwards to help you out, help you learn the track and provide parts to keep you going in time of need.We want you to come here and race with us. I think we are the most competitive region in the US with tons of talent. This incident may have been a black eye but I assure you we are a first class group and can hang with anyone, anywhere.

2. Voytec was blocking. More than once. I will not say he got what he deserved but I will say with certainty he will not do it again unless he is Plum Nuts. If he does, HE will get what he deserves. He does not have to come on here to defend himself nor should he.We will talk to him in person next time we all see him. Nuff said.It's over.He is on the radar.

3. Jeff Labounty is well respected and has helped numerous drivers and others in time of need. Jeff on the track is a different animal. He is the Dale Earnhardt of Miata's. LOL. Jeff is a very fair driver and has always raced 90% clean. He only gets out of hand when he is cut off, blocked, ( more than once) screwed up or you / they became aggressive. Once you show him disrespect or any of the things mentioned it's game on, no holds barred full contact circle track racing. I know this is not circle track but this is where he comes from. Point is don't cheat, cut off or be blatant and you will have no problems. Jeff actually does what I only think about doing or wanting to do but my discipline comes in and stops me.There are many times I have wanted to return a favor and we all are guilty of it.I also do not think that, had he had a second to think about it, he would have chose a different method with Voyteck or place. I was not there so I cannot state what actually happened and neither can any of you with 100% certainty. Jeff, Andrew, Danny, Voytec,Sparks, Pombo, Clements, Drago and all others are my friends. I think my assessment of Jeff is true and non biased.Yes he has had many incidents and just look at the videos. He does not give you one inch. You have to earn every one.If you think he is wrong, protest him or bring it up to the stewards that day. Don't wait to post the complaints here. That is Monday Morning Quarterback and Voytec DID NOT do a complaint.My feelings are if the parties involved do not do the paperwork who are we to question them?

4. Nate Sparks. Maybe you misunderstood me. I think you are a hell of a driver and I want you in this class for years to come. I think the better you get that you will leave us and move up to the pro's in a few years. You are a clean driver and I will race you anytime. Just be patient dealing with the old folks and their walkers. See you on the next race, No hard feelings at all.

5. Andrew Von Charbonaugh. Guys, I apologize for his lack of spelling grammar, his weird, comical videos, to Danny for calling you 133 times in one night being a pest, to the announcers at the Run offs for having to say " All jacked up on Mountain Dew Andrew C.", for being an instigator on very damn subject known to man and finally to his wife. We warned her. He is one warped, strange man and we have tried to wind him in. It's hopeless. After all, he's the champ until October so let him have his fun. He is 90% full of $%^&.

6. Dave College and others. I am sorry that I have to use my friend as an example. Rumors at the track say your car is either cheated up, on fuel or both. I never accused you of cheating and I believe you are innocent until proven guilty.I think that if those who are saying your car is cheated up and they do not protest the next time I will give up their names as they lack balls to actually go and do the papers. I do know that the others will be taking a hard look at you and some other drivers with really strong engines and I assure you that they will protest you if you or anyone else is showing impressive results. If you are complying and you are driving that well, there are a lot of people that will owe you an explanation and a retraction. We only want all the drivers reading this to know we want a fair, no fueled, not cheated up race among our peers. And Dave, if you have improved to compete against Drago, Charbonaugh, Sandlin and Van Vurst. Hats off to you. Good job.I am still trying to beat them.

7. It's easy for all of us to blame others and show video to prove a point. A video only shows a one sided partial view of tunnel vision. To make the point. Have you looked at the football reviews and shown one angle and it looks very convincing. But another camera angle shows something that the first totally missed and contradicts the first. Strange how that works but it is true. It shows that you cannot see everything and that in fractions of a second you have a nano second to implement a choice. I am amazed we do this well at the speed, turns, pace and cars involved.

To put this subject to an end. I say let's learn from this and in the future do what is required by us all. If you are involved in an incident with another driver, either go talk to him personally or file a protest.If you do neither take you wine and go home. Don't post you bitching here. You will be called out for it. If you think someone is cheating, protest them and put them into the stewards realm. If he cheated then shame on him. If he did not and he is clean, go up to him and say your sorry, no hard feelings, I was wrong. You should never be ashamed to ask to have a car protested if you REASONABLY think they are cheating.This should be standard practice and should happen to at least one car every race weekend. If it will break the ice, protest my car next race. Break that SOB all the way down. I will not be mad, I will be happy as long as I get out by 7 : ). That way everyone knows my car is clean and we can go to the next one. Protesting is not disrespect. It is keeping all of us HONEST and a badge of honor and courage. I will give away patches to those that do protests and win it. The more protests the better. So, Let's show some nads and let those mechanics earn their money. Who here would be offended if they were protested by their fellow racer or friend? Not me. I welcome it.
Semper Fi!

Great post Ciff
Jim

[Andrew Charbonneau]

I been trying to say that the whole time.

could have said it better but my grmmer sucks

drago still running you of in circle track racing

and cliff well said coming from someone who eats people

[Andrew Charbonneau]

this is the end after that post would like to end it with the end

[dmathias]

Gee, I hate to trump AC's graceful exit, but I just got an email from NASA giving their new contact policy (see below). Honestly, why can't this work in the SCCA too? Don't tell me you haven't got the personnel in impound. There's always 3-4 guys sittin' in lawn chairs shootin' the shiz. -DM

Body Contact Drive Through Impound Process
The NASA CCR requires all drivers involved in body contact while on the track to report to impound. This enhanced procedure will eliminate the need for drivers to go to NASA Central to complete body contact forms. The following only pertains to those involved in body contact while on the track.

Driver (with car) reports directly to Impound after exiting track and remains in the car. NASA TECH will provide driver with a bottle of water and clipboard with body contact form.

NASA TECH will video the exterior of the car while the driver completes the form in the car. NASA TECH will collect the Body Contact Form.

Once Tech personnel retrieves body contact form, Driver may return to paddock. Race Director will collect body contact forms and Tech video directly from Tech a minimum of 30 minutes after session. Race Director will review body contact forms and video collected from Tech and
render a decision.

NOTE: If the driver has additional evidence (witnesses or video), it is the drivers responsibility to note this on the Body Contact Form and provide the information to NASA Tech within 30 minutes of the conclusion of the track session or other time as determined by the Race Director. Race Director will post penalties to the Results at NASA Central. Any appeals will be handled per the CCR.

P.S. Love "Little Big Man" - Faye Dunaway looked HOT!

[Danny Steyn]

Cliffie
thanks

[Glenn]

Great post Ciff
Jim

+1

[Nsparks]

I look forward to seeing everyone at VIR. I'm feeling good about this event. I painted the front/rear bumper and stickered them up with new Vynals. Also on the to do list is put on the new shocks from Stewart Development and try new brake compounds in the rear from Carbotech.

[Weekend Warrior]

Sparky FTW at VIR

[wheel]

Since we have reached the end, my friend, this post doesn't count. I'm experienced. 36 years in SCCA with several hundreds of races. I'm also very mild mannered, helpful, kind, calm and oh, nevermind. Given that, if you block a couple of times, you are going off. Blocking is worse than brake checking, and I hate brake checking. Blocking is worse than boinking my sister. So..... Anyone who blocks needs to realize that they may reap the rewards of what they have sown.

wheel

[Cliff Brown USMC]

Since we have reached the end, my friend, this post doesn't count. I'm experienced. 36 years in SCCA with several hundreds of races. I'm also very mild mannered, helpful, kind, calm and oh, nevermind. Given that, if you block a couple of times, you are going off. Blocking is worse than brake checking, and I hate brake checking. Blocking is worse than boinking my sister. So..... Anyone who blocks needs to realize that they may reap the rewards of what they have sown.

wheel

[Cliff Brown USMC]

OK. After reviewing my comments I have one redaction and I am at fault for my blind retardation. No offense to retards or A.C. I am sorry to admit that Andrew Charbonaugh is only half full of $%^&. Half of his points are valid, inspirational,sometimes thought provoking,irrational, truthful, spot on and actually factual. But the rest is just BS. It's up to all to figure out which is what.
Hope this helps clarfy my remarks. Andrew. Please grace us with your posts. Carry on.

Kindest regards,

[Ken SM94]

Can I get that last 1.5 hours back?

[Ron Alan]

Can I get that last 1.5 hours back?

LOL Isn't that the truth!

Since I've been reading this forum(specmiata.com) I think this type of thread has occurred 2 or 3 times. Not always the same players and names but always boils down to the same end result. Your either willing to take another car out or your not...its as simple as that.


Danny, more people than you know share your principles AND FRUSTRATION!. Keep taking the high road.

[Alex Bolanos]

Great post Ciff
Jim

Word, see you boys at VIR

[Tom OPM]

Cliff great post, thanks for putting this to bed, thats more than you have said in the 2 years I have known you. Back to the fun stuff at VIR, like pushing people in the bushes !!!

I am worried, I think Charb's posts are normal and I understand them.

Nate great to have you racing with us, go easy on the walker set and you will not have any problems.

If you think something is wrong or you have been wronged do something about it. Quit bitching.

Come by our hauler at VIR and I will buy everyone a really old beer.