134 replies to this topic

[OrangeCrush86]

I fill my tires with helium to reduce the load on the bearing races.

[Alberto]

Can you fill the balls with helium so they are bigger?  

Besides lube/grease, seems like all you need is some bigger balls in your hubs and axles to shoot to the top of the SM field....   

[Jim Drago]

Can you fill the balls with helium so they are bigger?  

Besides lube/grease, seems like all you need is some bigger balls to shoot to the top of the SM field....   

fixed that for you

[Tom Hampton]

fixed that for you

Nice...

[Steve Scheifler]

From the 2010 discussion and the person who posted it:
“Both hubs are torqued to 90.”
...
“The original video explains that the demonstration was done without a seal and without grease so that those viewing it could get an apples to apples comparison of what the REM process did to the parts without any variables to cloud the results. No machining, no smoke and mirrors.”

I take everything from him with a truckload of salt but I believe the torque statement and wouldn’t bet the farm against the other. Not that it matters, particularly IF most failures begin with instantaneous loads dinging race and/or ball.

[Bench Racer]

“The original video explains that the demonstration was done without a seal and without grease so that those viewing it could get an apples to apples comparison of what the REM process did to the parts without any variables to cloud the results. No machining, no smoke and mirrors.”

 

Therefore there is value in the video for anyone who hadn't viewed the video. Even with a truck load of salt, the guy is always out front in more ways than many.

[Ernie Cole]

Inspired by this thread to rebuild my hubs, I ripped everything apart, cleaned and packed my front hubs. After getting those back on the car I set to cleaning/packing an old set of OEM hubs that have never been apart before to have as a backup. When I pulled those apart the seal was not in good condition. I just re-used the seal on first set (is that ok to do?), but don't want to reuse the seals on the older set of hubs as they are dried out and cracking.  Are these seals available individually? I can't find them at any of my usual sources, and even on the Mazda website can't a find a diagram of the blown apart front hub to get a P/N.

 

 

[FTodaro]

Inspired by this thread to rebuild my hubs, I ripped everything apart, cleaned and packed my front hubs. After getting those back on the car I set to cleaning/packing an old set of OEM hubs that have never been apart before to have as a backup. When I pulled those apart the seal was not in good condition. I just re-used the seal on first set (is that ok to do?), but don't want to reuse the seals on the older set of hubs as they are dried out and cracking.  Are these seals available individually? I can't find them at any of my usual sources, and even on the Mazda website can't a find a diagram of the blown apart front hub to get a P/N.

Advanced Autosports has some seals they sell but they do not fit every style of OEM hub. I have lots of used ones from collecting them on failed hubs. there are folks out there that do not run the seals, to reduce drag, but you need to repack  them every weekend or so or after a wet session.

Even if they are in bad shape they will provide some protection.

[Brandon]

Seconding the seals from Advanced Autosports (link below). As Frank notes, if your hub has the thin metal flange on the inner race, you have to remove it to use those AA seals. It's not difficult (I've used channel locks) but the race won't seat with that flange still attached.

 

Regarding running w/o the seal? That's the first I've heard of people doing it but different strokes and all that.

Regarding repacking after a wet weekend? That's my standard procedure and be sure to get the hub off the car as soon as you can afterward as you run the risk of moisture rusting the ball or hub surfaces and rendering it not rebuildable.

 

https://www.advanced...l-bearing-seals

[Jim Drago]

or here
https://mazdaracers....eals-1990-2005/

[Tom Sager]

or here
https://mazdaracers....eals-1990-2005/

 

Looks like you're $.05 above market price. 

[Jim Drago]

Looks like you're $.05 above market price.

That's bc I sprinkle that magic dust on them

[Brandon]

That's bc I sprinkle that magic dust on them

[Bench Racer]

or here
https://mazdaracers....eals-1990-2005/

[Pat Mcg]

I just want the details...  like specifics..  PN, findings etc..  I bought 8 different types...  Its not the cost... its the details etc.  Sure... Buy mine..  they are the best.  Got it.  But..  I want to know exactly why one hub is different than another.. etc.. 

 

Weight, dimensions PN being used, balls, cage type etc.  I purchased from 25 bucks each... to 223 dollars each..  Not seeing to much variation with the exception of my old 1990 hubs... 

 

Unicorn wax and plasma magic seals is the only striking difference i have found between the 25 dollar hub and the 230... but thats just visual inspection..  Sending all the bearings out individually bagged for weight, specs of each..  Guess will see...  Im no pro shop so..  I know there are differences.. 

 

Here are the hubs I am tearing apart:  I am certain this has been done by all the shops...  but.. i can't find it anywhere..

 

713152  Raybestos  105.68  These were the only ones straight out of the box... you put on your hand and twirl..  would just spin effortlessly..   Nothing scientific... just first impression.

405.45005E Centric  46.00

BHA53367  TRQ...   these are 60 bucks for a pair..   Never seen before..  They came from Worldpak   Also seen on Amazon.

29513152  DuraGo  25 bucks  the cheapo I have a set of these on my 99 daily driver now for 40K miles...  its not racing.. but.. haven't had any issues.  Installed straight from box..

BR930143 SKF 114 bucks  

0000-04-5HUB-S1  Endurance Hub  223.50   Mazda Parts Store  This is what i currently use.  I disassemble and repack with previously discussed unicorn wax.. 

513152 Mogg  107.99  Used these before.  Have not had any issues.  I have one in my trailer for spare.

0000-04-5HUB-01  HD Hub.  190.50  Mazda parts Store

 

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[Jim Drago]

Pat
Weight is not a factor, or much. You need to do some hardness testing. Save your money on all the cheapo less than 50 a hub parts. I guess you can check, but they are all junk.

Any of the ones like Moog have NTN on the bearing? The older Moogs used NTN, they have since switched, not sure about the quality of the new ones

[Pat Mcg]

Pat
Weight is not a factor, or much. You need to do some hardness testing. Save your money on all the cheapo less than 50 a hub parts. I guess you can check, but they are all junk.

Any of the ones like Moog have NTN on the bearing? The older Moogs used NTN, they have since switched, not sure about the quality of the new ones

What about the cages that house the actual balls..  there seems to be some wide swing in variation..  not an engineer but some seem very robust and others not so much..  impact to rotation and straight durability..  Or perhaps they literally just hold the balls in place and have not impact one way or another..  any opinion on that?

[Jim Drago]

What about the cages that house the actual balls..  there seems to be some wide swing in variation..  not an engineer but some seem very robust and others not so much..  impact to rotation and straight durability..  Or perhaps they literally just hold the balls in place and have not impact one way or another..  any opinion on that?

yes

The biggest failure and safety issue however is the races and just shit casting that break off the car. I would NOT risk any of those cheap ones in a race car. Not sure how you would test the quality of the casting short of being a crash tester. There are pictures showing what castings should look like that are true oem replacements and the cheapos. Look at the Moog and SKF, they should be good quality, look at the where the stud go through. If the casting there looks different, send them back without testing

 

 

The best hubs we have built /used are original OEM unchanged hubs that we rebuild. Most prefer new rebuilt, I personally prefer used OEM hubs with better quality balls and new seals.  The races are hardened throughout, most of the newer ones are surface hardened at best. that is the main failure spot 

[Jason Knuteson]

Question for everyone! Where is the best place to get high quality replacement balls for the OEM hubs?

[av8tor]

Question for everyone! Where is the best place to get high quality replacement balls for the OEM hubs?

I hear these are the best. https://www.ortechce...vEaArdMEALw_wcB